Need help to build a new server

[Proxipupuce]

Memtest tests that memory is operating to specifications. There are bad memory modules in the wild, including ECC modules. Not many hopefully, but it's best to check.

Okay, then I'll run MemTest.

 

[Proxipupuce]

Over the last few days, I've come back to Etorix's idea of buying more recent hardware, for example with the ASRock Rack E3C246D4U2-2T motherboard.

Despite the higher price, it's true that this board has a better datasheet than the Supermicro board, especially for the 10 GB Ethernet ports.
However, on reading the documentation, I realize that it is said to be compatible with Intel® Xeon® E series -2100/E-2200 processors.

Having looked into the matter, these processors are, as it happens, really out of my price range (on average €150-200 for a Xeon E-2136).
So I was wondering, are the Xeon E3-127xx v6 compatible with this motherboard?

If not, what is the reason for the much higher price of the Xeon® E -2100/E-2200 series?

Thanks in advance!

 

[Etorix]

LGA1151-2 (Coffee Lake: Core 8000/9000, Xeon E-2100/2200) is electrically incompatible with LGA1151 (Skylake/Kaby Lake: Core 6000/7000, Xeon E3-1200 v5/v6). Intel wants you to buy everything anew every two generations. ("C'est une révolution ! Il faut TOUT racheter !")

But you can use a Core i3-8100/9100 with C246 and have ECC. Only four cores but these are cheap and plentiful.

 

[Ericloewe]

LGA1151-2 (Coffee Lake: Core 8000/9000, Xeon E-2100/2200) is electrically incompatible with LGA1151 (Skylake/Kaby Lake: Core 6000/7000, Xeon E3-1200 v5/v6). Intel wants you to buy everything anew every two generations. ("C'est une révolution ! Il faut TOUT racheter !")

Actually, they are electrically compatible, it's purely a software thing (and theoretically a power delivery thing, but that's a dodgy argument).

I was just wondering if this was also true for servers

So much so that I've had servers die (yes, die) due to broken firmware that was mishandling one of the voltage regulators, causing premature wear. Two servers gone in a handful of months. Three of the other four we had, after we updated the firmware, are still working, one died ~three years later. Lenovo x3550 m5.

 

[Proxipupuce]

But you can use a Core i3-8100/9100 with C246 and have ECC. Only four cores but these are cheap and plentiful.

That's right, I'd completely forgotten that I3 cores support ECC RAM! After looking, yes, you can find a lot of I3-9100f around 35 €. Thanks a lot!

 

[Proxipupuce]

So much so that I've had servers die (yes, die) due to broken firmware that was mishandling one of the voltage regulators, causing premature wear. Two servers gone in a handful of months. Three of the other four we had, after we updated the firmware, are still working, one died ~three years later. Lenovo x3550 m5.

Okay, that reinforces my belief in the need for constant updating!

 

[Proxipupuce]

Another point: I searched the ASRock site for a list of RAMs compatible with the motherboard I mentioned above. However, I was unable to find an official list.
Do you have any information on this, or can any ECC RAM from known manufacturers (Like Samsung or Micron) do the trick?
Sorry to ask this, but perhaps you have links to offers with reliable RAM? I've done a lot of searching today, but there are so many offers that I'm not sure how to choose.
I'm looking for 4*8 GB or 2*16 GB. I'd prefer 2*16 GB to save a bit of energy and keep the possibility of upgrading.
Thanks a lot!

 

[Etorix]

I would trust ECC RAM from major manufacturers to just work.
As for the QVL, we've seen in another thread that the E3C246D4U2-2T curiously has none; take those from the -2L2T variant or the E3C242D4U2 siblings.

 

[Proxipupuce]

Okay, I've looked at these compatibility lists.
However, they don't leave much choice. So I'm going to concentrate on memories from the best-known manufacturers.

I also have a question about the difference between RDIMM RAMs and UDIMM RAMs.
From what I understand, RDIMM RAMs have register chips that UDIMM RAMs do not.

However, on sites like ebay, there seem to be many more RDIMM RAMs than UDIMM RAMs for sale.

The ASRock motherboard is said to be compatible with UDIMM RAM.
So I was wondering, can RDIMM RAM be installed on a UDIMM slot? I've read that this isn't possible, but I'd like confirmation.
Can't RDIMM RAM work as UDIMM RAM if the motherboard doesn't support this feature?

 

[Etorix]

No and no.

Core, Xeon E, E3 and W-1000 (= Core with ECC) and Ryzen only support UDIMM.
To use cheaper and higher capacity RDIMM you need to go for Xeon E5, Scalable, W-2000, W-3000, Xeon-D, Atom C or EPYC.

 

[Proxipupuce]

No and no.

Core, Xeon E, E3 and W-1000 (= Core with ECC) and Ryzen only support UDIMM.
To use cheaper and higher capacity RDIMM you need to go for Xeon E5, Scalable, W-2000, W-3000, Xeon-D, Atom C or EPYC.

Okay, thanks !

 

[Proxipupuce]

Good evening! I'm getting close to my final configuration, and I'd like an objective opinion in terms of benefits/price for the following two configurations:

First configuration: €320

Motherboard: Supermicro X11SSH-LN4F
CPU: Intel Xeon E3-1245v6
RAM: SK Hynix 2 x 16 GB ECC UDIMM DDR4-2400

Second configuration: €450

Motherboard: ASRock E3C246D4U2-2T (€265)
CPU: Intel Core I3 9100F (€35)
RAM: Samsung 2 x 32 GB ECC UDIMM DDR4-3200 (here limited to 2400 Mhz) (€150)


Prices include taxes and delivery.
If you were in my shoes, which configuration would you choose, given these prices?

 

[Etorix]

Both configurations provide 4C/8T at similar frequencies (within 0.1 GHz). The 9100F drops the iGPU, if there ever is a use for it, but a 9100 would likely not break the bank. Same RAM limit at 64 GB for now, but a Xeon E-2000 would push the limit to 128 GB, possibly with more cores.
The difference in RAM somewhat obfuscate the comparison, but the extra 130 E buys 10 GbE, 32 GB RAM and an extra M.2 slot. Fair price.

If you're satisfied with 4C/8T, go for the X11SSH, which may be bumped later to 4*16 GB.
If you think you may need more cores and/or more than 64 GB RAM at some point (which the 2*32 GB might point to…), go for AsRock Rack (not the same company as consumer-minded AsRock) and wait for an opportunity on a Xeon E-2000.

 

[dak180]

Second configuration: €450

Motherboard: ASRock E3C246D4U2-2T (€265)
CPU: Intel Core I3 9100F (€35)
RAM: Samsung 2 x 32 GB ECC UDIMM DDR4-3200 (here limited to 2400 Mhz) (€150)

This would be my personal preference, having both the aspeed 2500 (html5 no java) and the ability to independently control every fan are the things that push it over the edge for me.

 

[Proxipupuce]

a 9100 would likely not break the bank.

I agree, in fact I'd just gone for the F version, as I couldn't see the point of an IGPU. However, if it's better, I'll take this!

If you think you may need more cores and/or more than 64 GB RAM at some point (which the 2*32 GB might point to…), go for AsRock Rack (not the same company as consumer-minded AsRock) and wait for an opportunity on a Xeon E-2000.

I'm not sure at the moment, but I'm thinking of going for it, as I'd need more recent equipment and the possibility of upgrading.

 

[Proxipupuce]

This would be my personal preference, having both the aspeed 2500 (html5 no java) and the ability to independently control every fan are the things that push it over the edge for me.

Thanks for your feedback!

 

[Proxipupuce]

So, to review, my new configuration would give :

- Motherboard: ASRock Rack E3C246D4U2-2T
- CPU: Intel Core I3 9100F
- RAM: Samsung 2 x 32 GB ECC UDIMM DDR4-3200 (here limited to 2400 Mhz)
- System installed on a PNY 240 GO NVME SSD connected on the motherboard
- Storage: 3x 3 TB western digital red RAIDZ1 connected in SATA 6 Gb/s (later 6x 6 TB RAIDZ2)
- Iocage on 120 Go SSD connected in SATA 6 Gb/s (or in NVME, I haven't decided yet)
- PSU: Seasonic Focus PX-750
- Case: Nanoxia Deep Silence 4

I think this is a good configuration, but does anyone have any final comments or suggestions?

Quick question, I found the Seasonic Focus PX-750 power supply for less than €100 second-hand. After discussion with the seller, the power supply has apparently been used very little. Do you think it's a good idea to buy it used, or would it be better to buy it new?

 

[Etorix]

Solid configuration. I mostly buy used for motherboards, CPU and RAM but new for data drives and PSU—tough a "lighly used" PSU would be a good opportunity.

I agree, in fact I'd just gone for the F version, as I couldn't see the point of an IGPU.

Either transcoding videos or hosting a desktop OS, which needs a GPU, in a VM. If none applies, there's indeed no point.

Edit Mind that evolving from 3-wide raidz1 to 6-wide raidz2 involves backing up, destroying the pool and creating a new pool—no in-place upgrade of geometry.

 

[Davvo]

Quick question, I found the Seasonic Focus PX-750 power supply for less than €100 second-hand. After discussion with the seller, the power supply has apparently been used very little. Do you think it's a good idea to buy it used, or would it be better to buy it new?

Do not buy used PSUs unless you A) have the capability to ascertain their health or B) you have deep confidence the seller is not telling you bullshit. It takes very little to lose your system to a faulty PSU.

 

[Proxipupuce]

Either transcoding videos or hosting a desktop OS, which needs a GPU, in a VM. If none applies, there's indeed no point.

For the moment, I don't do either. That said, it could happen in the future, so I'm thinking of getting an I3 9100.

Mind that evolving from 3-wide raidz1 to 6-wide raidz2 involves backing up, destroying the pool and creating a new pool—no in-place upgrade of geometry.

Yes, I still need to think about this. However, isn't it possible, on eight SATA ports, to connect the six new disks in RAIDZ2, and only two of the three disks in RAIDZ1 to copy the data? (In case I don't have any SSDs connected in SATA).