Switching from stupid samba share to TrueNAS - docker container, plex and file share

[JohnDoe111]

It's time for me to switch from my NUC6CAYH with an attached 6 TB external HDD (Western Digital Elements Desktop (WDBWLG), connected over USB 3.0) to a NAS. It is a low power consumption samba share setup which needs I am using this setup for 4 years right now, and it's only a matter of time until my data is gone forever.
This setup also handles my docker containers which I need for smart home stuff (homebridge, deconz, node red) and nextcloud environment (nextcloud, proxy, etc). In future i want these docker containers together with some other stuff (which isn't necessary to talk about) to run inside a virtual machine. Right now, my movies and stuff like that is also bum around on this samba share. When i want to watch a movie i simply double-click the file in my samba share and watch it via vlc player. Pretty unsatisfying, so maybe time to switch to Plex or something like that? Maybe i should consider this with the new setup.

So I want to use TrueNAS because of ZFS and RAID-Z support. I thought about a low power consumption setup like that:

Main board / CPU: ASRock N100DC-ITX with Intel N100 CPU
RAID Storage: 4x Kingston DC600M SSD with 4 TB each
OS NVMe: The 970 Evo (500 GB) from my current Tower PC and upgrade the Tower PC with a bigger one (win/win)
Case: Jonsbo N2
RAM: undecided, but in any case make full use of the 32 GB with 3200 memory
Also this will need a LSI HBA adapter in order to connect more than 2 SSDs. Feels like a weird workaround.

So this setup above seems to be pretty good in power consumption i guess. My knowledge in this kind of stuff is not that good but i am just terrified about having a machine which needs 80W in idle and around 100W under load running in my appartment 24/7 and leads to costs about 200 bucks a year.

Also, it fits nicely inside a ITX case which perfectly fits in a IKEA kallax shelf and having enough space left, right and behind the case for a good airflow.

Cons about this setup: Can this even handle Plex? I can't update to more than 32 GB memory and also i am not able to use ECC in the future. Also my main board is bound to the cpu so upgrading/changing the cpu will be annoying in future scenarios.

So all in all: I'm fine having a bigger size NAS setup which can't fit inside a shelf, that's the least important stuff. I want a good working machine for several docker container, bare metal TrueNAS, maybe PLEX which doesn't need high power consumption (maybe there are a lot of tweaks later which i doesn't know about?).
For example, a cool setup seems to be a Supermicro X11SSM-F together with a FCLGA1151 Intel CPU (i don't now which one would be good for my scenario?), 32GB/64GB ECC memory and a "real" power supply. But like i said, i'm afraid of the power consumption in 24/7 environment.

 

[tprelog]

Main board / CPU: ASRock N100DC-ITX with Intel N100 CPU

The link indicates that MB uses Realtek Gigabit LAN. Realtek is Realgarbage and should be avoided at all costs. A proper server motherboard from Supermicro is almost guaranteed to be a better choice but I'll leave it to the more advanced users to indicate which one.

FWIW - The server in my signature only uses about 35W on average when not under load.

 

[Davvo]

Cons about this setup: Can this even handle Plex? I can't update to more than 32 GB memory and also i am not able to use ECC in the future. Also my main board is bound to the cpu so upgrading/changing the cpu will be annoying in future scenarios.

It can run plex, but it won't transcode.
From the list you gave us 32GB of RAM should be enough; not having ECC is a bummer, but if you have to buy an HBA in order to use more than 2 drvies I would go for alternatives.

As @tprelog wrote you can totally go with a 4 to 8 cores Xeon with that kind of motherboard. They can be found for cheap (less than €60).

 

[JohnDoe111]

It can run plex, but it won't transcode.

I guess this would need a dedicated gpu?

From the list you gave us 32GB of RAM should be enough; not having ECC is a bummer, but if you have to buy an HBA in order to use more than 2 drvies I would go for alternatives.

I am thinking about several other setups right now and get rid of the N100 motherboard idea. For example with a Fujitsu D3644-H or Fujitsu D3417-B2, both should also work with Intel Xeon E3-1220 v6. I l know a lot of user in this community recommend the Supermicro X11SSH-F but is it as power efficient as the Fujitsu boards?

 

[Davvo]

I guess this would need a dedicated gpu?

An iGPU with Quick Sync might very well suffice.

For example with a Fujitsu D3644-H or Fujitsu D3417-B2, both should also work with Intel Xeon E3-1220 v6. I l know a lot of user in this community recommend the Supermicro X11SSH-F but is it as power efficient as the Fujitsu boards?

The Fujitsu are known to apparently draw less since they lack a few features (ie IPMI), but honestly I and most users have no clue due to them being hard to find and a lack of appeal. Personally I prefer a server-grade hardware due to features and ease of procurement.
Iirc the average power draw in idle state with a Xeon in the X11SSH-F and similar boards is around 30W (system power measured at wall).

If you dig around in the forum you can find some numbers.

 

[JohnDoe111]

An iGPU with Quick Sync might very well suffice.

Any suggestions? The Xeon E3-1220 v6 doesn't use quick sync, but i3-8100T and i3-10300 seems to use it.

 

[JohnDoe111]

whoops, i3-10300 doesn't support ecc. Maybe Xeon E-2244G is a good one? But it's rather expensive in comparison with other intel CPUs

 

[Davvo]

First of all, don't limit yourself with the T versions: you can easily get great power efficency withouth a thermal limit.
The E-2244G would be a great choice, but if you look for something a bit cheaper there is the E-2124G that can be found for around €160 or even less: it's basically a marginally slower 2244G withouth HT (so you only get 4 threads, one per core).

However do note that both this options are not compatible with the X11SSH-F you posted (or even the Fujitsu boards).
The compatible board similar to the one you posted about is the X11SCH-F; do note the SC: that's what you wanto to seach in Supermicro's motherboards if you want to go with E-2XXX.

If you want to stay on the X11SSH-F or similar, you have plenty of great options as well: starting from Pentiums (which might be a bit skinny for all your dockers and plex and SMB) to the E3-1230v6 (speeds comparable with the Pentiums but with double the thread count), both of which can be found for around €40.

All in all depends on which is your priority: if you don't seek great SMB speeds, you don't actually need the Boost Clock advantage of the E-2XXX over the E3-1230v6, with the latter giving you double the threads. Power consumption of these two models should be almost equal, assuming a 50% usage h24 you would pay around €45 (with 0,30 € per kW) yearly.

TL;DR: for your use case I would suggest going for the E3-1230v6 over the E-2124G; if you don't factor in "several docker containers", or if those are low-computational needs, consider the Pentium G4560 for maximum power saving.

EDIT: the E3-1230v6 does not have an iGPU or Quick Sync, so I'd guess it's out of your selection. That's only if you transcode with Plex though.​

 

[JohnDoe111]

Thank you for this great post! On the long run, i think i will go with X11SCH-F together with a Xeon E-2124G. I want to set it up "correctly" right from the start so that I don't have to replace the CPU six months later.

Edit: Actually my intel nuc is running a Intel Celeron J3455 right now which handles my docker containers very well (cpu in idle is 3-6 %, under heavier load more like 60% but this happens far rarely). So i only want to add FreeNAS and Plex, so a G4560 could indeed totally do the trick for me. Quite hard to choose between the G4560 and E-2124G.

 

[Davvo]

So I only want to add FreeNAS and Plex, so a G4560 could indeed totally do the trick for me. Quite hard to choose between the G4560 and E-2124G.

Main issue is that the motherboard is different, so you can't even go with the G4560 and upgrade to the E-2124G if you need more brawn. Quite a hard choice indeed... probably it could be worth spending a bit more for the E-2124G and the X11SCH-F since it can leave you with more options at hand if in the next 5-8 years your needs grow (both in CPU and motherboard requirements); that being said, as you wrote the G4560 should be able to faithfully serve your current needs and a bit more. I love my little pentium though; would be interesting hearing other users' opinion.

TL;DR: if you want flexibility to expand, go E-2124G and X11SCH-F; if you want to save money, go G4560 and X11SSH-F.

On another side, have you decided your case (since it looks you settled in for micro-ATX boards the N2 isn't fit) and your pool layout? With 4 SSDs I'm suggesting a single VDEV in RAIDZ1. You will likelly be fine with 16GB or RAM, but if you go for the E-2124G take a single 32GB module in order to potentially use the full 128 GB of RAM the MB supports.​

 

[JohnDoe111]

Yeah, the price difference between E-2124G/X11SCH-F vs G4560/X11SSH-F is together around 500 bucks if I buy the tray version of the CPU. Where not talking about 50 or 100 Euro, damn. The G4560 would also save me some power. Damn.

So no, i am thinking and planning a good build right now, so i didn't decide for a case yet. It can me micro-ATC or mATX or even ATX. Doesn't matter that much as long as the build is good. Also i want to put the NAS in another room, so i get rid of the 4x SSD idea and thinking about 4x HDDs instead. The build should be something like that:
4x HDD in RAIDZ (thought about RAIDZ2 but i'm open for suggestion), 1x M2 for TrueNAS OS and 2x SSDs (mirrored) as one VDEV for my docker container and other stuff. This will use the one m2 slot on the main board and all 6 SATA ports. I don't want to use a hba adapter as this would consume more power, I think around 10-15 watt only the adapter.
I thought about this RAM, as i want one single 64 GB memory.

 

[Davvo]

Yeah, the price difference between E-2124G/X11SCH-F vs G4560/X11SSH-F is together around 500 bucks if I buy the tray version of the CPU.​

Well, I guess we have a winner then.

With a X11SSH-F and a G4560 you would have eight SATA ports, which means you can go 6x HDDs in RAIDZ2 (are you planning to spindown them? They consume more than SSDs), 2-way mirror of SSDs for your VM pool, and this leaves you the option of using either the internal USB port for the boot drive or the M.2 (which could be useful for L2ARC). Do note that Supermicro's tested only up to 16GB sticks, so a single 64GB might not work... if you want 64GB, I suggest going with four 16GB sticks.​

 

[JohnDoe111]

First of all, thanks for the great help, i really appreciate this.
The M.2 for L2ARC idea is pretty good. How much L2ARC is "too much"? I mean, i want to buy a SK hynix NVMe (don't know if gold or platinum), 500 MB enough? Or maybe 1 or 2 TB? Or is this overkill?

Any suggestions for the HDD? I thought about Kingston DC600M as i heard weird stuff about WD red lately. Good price per performance is important as i want to buy 4x 12 TB.

Also i need a case. The Jonsbo N2 can only handle mini ATX, so i need something else. Something with a form factor of a cube OR like a tower pc but which is lay down on the side - so it can be wide but not high. So like this or this.

 

[Davvo]

The M.2 for L2ARC idea is pretty good. How much L2ARC is "too much"? I mean, i want to buy a SK hynix NVMe (don't know if gold or platinum), 500 MB enough? Or maybe 1 or 2 TB? Or is this overkill.

Generally, the best ratio for performance (the L2ARC is referenced into the RAM, so it takes performance out from there since RAM is faster) is 1:4 of RAM to L2ARC, but can be pushed as high as 1:8; overprovisioning/underprovisioning (different name but same thing) is usually done to increase the drive's lifespan and it basically means using a larger drive (ie a 500GB drive) and partitioning in a way that let's TN use only part of it (ie 250GB) in order to lower the cell's wear. Do note that the minimum RAM required for considering L2ARC is 64GB.
You could totally use your old 970 EVO of 500GB and either fully use it (64*6 ≈ 500 GB) or use only half of it (64*4 ≈ 250GB).
​

Any suggestions for the HDD? I thought about Kingston DC600M as i heard weird stuff about WD red lately. Good price per performance is important as i want to buy 4x 12 TB.

Any CMR nas/enterprise drive is OK, usually the choice is between WD RED (PLUS and PRO, the base model is the worst SMR drive for ZFS) and Seagate Ironwolf (Standard or Pro, both CMR). Usually the difference between PLUS/Standard and PRO versions is a longer warranty (5 years vs 3) and sometimes better performance. Generally, you want to look for lower RPM drives since it means less heat, power confumption, and noise (ie a 5900 RPM drive will consume less than a 7200 RPM one).
​

Also i need a case. The Jonsbo N2 can only handle mini ATX, so i need something else. Something with a form factor of a cube OR like a tower pc but which is lay down on the side - so it can be wide but not high. So like this or this.

1. Fractal NODE 804, up to 10x 3.5'' slots and an additional 2x 2.5'' slots, comes with 3 fans and a fan controller.​
2. ThermalTake Core X5, 4x 3.5’' with 3x 2.5'' and 3x 5.25’’ bays; don't know how the temps are.​
3. Itek EVOKE, up to 5x 3.5'' slots and an additional 2x 2.5''... comes with a noisy 80mm fan; it can be challenging to properly cool the drives... there is no place for fans with more than 4x 3.5'', and you will want 90° adapters for data and power.​

I have 1 and 3, both are great cases, but the EVOKE might be a bit challenging.

 

[JohnDoe111]

Any CMR nas/enterprise drive is OK, usually the choice is between WD RED (PLUS and PRO, the base model is the worst SMR drive for ZFS) and Seagate Ironwolf (Standard or Pro, both CMR). Usually the difference between PLUS/Standard and PRO versions is a longer warranty (5 years vs 3) and sometimes better performance. Generally, you want to look for lower RPM drives since it means less heat, power confumption, and noise (ie a 5900 RPM drive will consume less than a 7200 RPM one).​

Is Seagate even selling the Ironwolf with less than 7200 rpm? I can only find the WD Red with 5400 rpm.

Generally, the best ratio for performance (the L2ARC is referenced into the RAM, so it takes performance out from there since RAM is faster) is 1:4 of RAM to L2ARC, but can be pushed as high as 1:8; overprovisioning/underprovisioning (different name but same thing) is usually done to increase the drive's lifespan and it basically means using a larger drive (ie a 500GB drive) and partitioning in a way that let's TN use only part of it (ie 250GB) in order to lower the cell's wear. Do note that the minimum RAM required for considering L2ARC is 64GB.
You could totally use your old 970 EVO of 500GB and either fully use it (64*6 ≈ 500 GB) or use only half of it (64*4 ≈ 250GB).​

So 64 GB Ram for 250 GB NVMe to keep this 1:4 ratio. I think i will totaly use my old evo for this and buy a new/bigger (~2 TB) one for my tower pc.

 

[Davvo]

Is Seagate even selling the Ironwolf with less than 7200 rpm? I can only find the WD Red with 5400 rpm.

The non-pro use 5400/5900 RPM up to 8TB, but it depends on the model; look in my system in the signature for an example.