Suggestions for motherboard upgrade?

[danb35]

So I'm considering upgrading my NAS to a newer motherboard. The Supermicro X9DRD-7LN4F-JBOD has worked well for the 7+ years I've had it, and I'm really not close to maxing it out, but the IPMI with its Java-based virtual console is a definite pain point, so I'm looking for somthing a bit newer. Hoping to get some suggestions for a replacement. Some needs/wants:

• I'm pretty sure I'd want to keep no less than the current 128 GB of RAM, but I doubt I'll need more than that
• Must have HTML5-based virtual console--no Java
• I rarely use a significant amount of CPU, so dual-socket isn't really needed
• I don't have strong feelings on Intel vs. AMD, though all my current gear is Intel FWIW
• The current board has an onboard LSI SAS HBA; I'm assuming I'll need that as an add-on card for the new board--I'm not expecting to find a new board with this integrated
• I'm assuming IPMI includes onboard (if limited) video; I don't intend to use a GPU with this
• I'm expecting to continue to use the Chelsio NIC, so onboard 10GbE isn't needed or particularly desirable
• I'm fine with my current Supermicro 847 36-bay chassis, but might consider converting it to a JBOD
• I'm not particularly interested in m.2 slots; my system boots from a SATA SSD
• Good availability on the secondary market is a plus--I'm probably favoring used gear here
• And, of course, budget is always a factor

I bought a Dell PowerEdge R630 a few months ago as a virtualization host, and its HBA had external SAS ports. It's otherwise a nice system, and its iDRAC seems to work quite nicely. It checks a lot of boxes, but at a price tag of around $1k it's a bit more than I'd like to spend. I'm having a little trouble navigating the Supermicro X11 line, and not finding much availability of used hardware there. And I haven't really kept up with the last few generations of CPUs or other hardware. Any suggestions on this would be appreciated.

 

[artlessknave]

I use an x11ssm.
the x10ssm/srl/srh realm boards have html5 (x10 is the min) without being ridiculous price wise.
x11 and newer the naming of the boards, naming of the CPUs, and availabity used tend to all get worse fairly fast that I have seen. they are rarely worth upgrading beyond, really. I want more pcie and more RAM but there is just not anything worth bothering that I have found yet.

 

[danb35]

Thanks for the suggestion, but especially with SCALE, I think I need more RAM than the SSM can handle. But I've run across a X11DPH-T for $400 including a pair of Xeon Gold 6132s, which sounds like a pretty attractive option--I'd need to get a pair of heatsinks that would fit 2U, and of course the RAM, but... It has onboard copper 10 GbE which I wouldn't be using, but I don't expect that would hurt anything. And of course a HBA, but a LSI 3008-series HBA isn't too pricey.

But you're right about the naming of the boards--I've always understood -F to be the marker for IPMI, but this -T board has it.

 

[Etorix]

-F indicates IPMI for single socket boards. All dual-socket boards have IPMI and -F is not used. (Why make it simple and consistent when you can make it minimalistic but complicated?)

$400 for a X11DPH and a pair of Xeon Gold is indeed a bargain, but if dual CPU is not needed you may be better served by a single socket board rather than populating a second socket just to enable more RAM and the whole set of PCIe devices.

 

[danb35]

All dual-socket boards have IPMI and -F is not used.

The first is good to know, but the second is not the case for my current board; F is among the characters following the hyphen. But of course that's an X9 series board, and plenty could have changed since then.

I don't need dual CPU for the sake of compute; over the last couple of months the system reporting shows minimum CPU idle time over 85%. And it looks like those 6132s clock about the same as my E5-2670s, but with six more cores each--so one of them sounds pretty close to both of my 2670s. I don't expect I need the RAM; it looks like that board takes up to 2 TB of RAM, so a single socket should handle up to 1 TB, and I don't see me exceeding the 128 GB I'm currently using. PCIe lanes? Well, my NIC needs x8, the HBA (might as well go for a 3008) takes another x8, and I'd assume the m.2 slots are x4 each--I don't have any current plans to use them, but they seem tailor-made for SLOG and/or L2ARC if/when I decide I need them. But a review of the manual looks like I should be able to do all that with just one CPU, and I suppose I'd save a few watts by removing the second one...

Does look like that motherboard would need SAS->SATA breakout cables to use the onboard SATA ports, though.

 

[Davvo]

The X11SSL-CF has an integrated controller.

 

[Jailer]

The X11SSL-CF has an integrated controller.

But only supports 64GB of RAM and @danb35 stated he wants at least 128GB.

Watching this one as my system, although it meets my current needs, is getting a bit long in tooth as well.

 

[Ericloewe]

Must have HTML5-based virtual console--no Java

No need for Java at all, or is "HTML5 for most things but you lose out on virtual media" okay? Because literally all -F X10s and X11s have an HTML5 viewer, which is great apart from the fact that it does not do virtual media at all.
(I used to not mind, but Java Webstart is getting ever more painful)

If you want HTML5 with virtual media, you'll need to look at X12+ and other manufacturers.

I bought a Dell PowerEdge R630 a few months ago as a virtualization host, and its HBA had external SAS ports. It's otherwise a nice system, and its iDRAC seems to work quite nicely. It checks a lot of boxes, but at a price tag of around $1k it's a bit more than I'd like to spend.

R630s are plentiful and often cheap if pre-configured. Custom configs get pretty expensive quickly from most vendors, though.

What you could do is sidegrade to an R620. You get to keep your components, but you get HTML5. Important caveats:

• iDRAC7/8 (same thing, they were unified some time ago) is slow (not as slow as Lenovo's PoS BMC, but slow).
• The servers are completely out of support, so you need to manually update all the firmware as applicable instead of using the automatic options that (I think) still work on Gen 13 and newer.
• Boot times are insanely painful when doing any sort of maintenance.
• Despite physical compatibility, actual software compatibility with Gen 13 parts is not guaranteed. The PSU situation is a hot, confusing mess. The NIC situation is more straightforward, but newer mezzanine NIC options like the Connect-X4 or X710+I350 are not supported.

 

[danb35]

Because literally all -F X10s and X11s have an HTML5 viewer, which is great apart from the fact that it does not do virtual media at all.

Yuck. Though my need for virtual media is much less frequent than my need (OK, desire) for a remote console. I'm thinking the X12 boards are likely to carry a significant premium, though.

(I used to not mind, but Java Webstart is getting ever more painful)

Agreed. I have a Windows 7 VM that I've been using for this purpose, and it works, for certain values of "works", but convenient it isn't--particularly since I use macOS for most of my desktop use.

The servers are completely out of support, so you need to manually update all the firmware as applicable instead of using the automatic options that (I think) still work on Gen 13 and newer.

That's a handy feature on the R630. It's obviously not one that gets used that often, but it's a convenient way to make sure that the vendor updated all the firmware on the system they just sold you.

 

[sfatula]

If you want HTML5 with virtual media, you'll need to look at X12+ and other manufacturers.

You can't use virtual media from the local machine perhaps the way java does, but you can load virtual media via SMB and still use html5 on x10. Am I mistaken? I believe that's how I loaded Truenas on my server. I can't even run java version on any of my machines.

 

[artlessknave]

SMB and still use html5 on x10

theoretically, yes, however, I have never, ever gotten the web page virtual media to work on any SM board.
I either use IPMIview or openwebstart; one includes java bypassing the java webstart issues, the other reimplements javaweb start in an open sourced, non-oracle-s^%t-on form

 

[sfatula]

theoretically, yes, however, I have never, ever gotten the web page virtual media to work on any SM board.
I either use IPMIview or openwebstart; one includes java bypassing the java webstart issues, the other reimplements javaweb start in an open sourced, non-oracle-s^%t-on form

I had no trouble at all. I think, but am not certain, I even used SMB from my router. If not, I simply used a Raspberry Pi for smb server. Ipmiview/java does not run on a Pi, or at least I could never get that to work. I had to use html5. I have no Windows machine.

 

[artlessknave]

IPMIview and openwebstart works on linux, though I do not know if there are arm compatible builds that would work on rpi. possibly not, rather niche.

I have 4 different generations of SM boards, and I have never gotten the smb thing to work...it's just a TrueNAS share, so i have no idea what is wrong, and of course it tells me nothing useful in the error.

 

[sfatula]

Sadly, didn't document any trick needed, if any. I'm not the only one though, lots of people have used it, you can find examples on the net. Perhaps default scale SMB options not good enough.

 

[artlessknave]

ya, i know people talk about using it all the time. serverthehome has a guide for it, and none of it ever works for me.

 

[sfatula]

My main point was an x10 board with html5 can use virtual media via smb, I guess I should add some tinkering may be necessary.

 

[Ericloewe]

ya, i know people talk about using it all the time. serverthehome has a guide for it, and none of it ever works for me.

Same here. I have never gotten it to work.

 

[sfatula]

For fun, using a SMB share from my Asus router. The router uses SMBv2. Worked first try.

 

[danb35]

I decided to go for the X11DPH. If anyone else is interested, the listing is here:

Supermicro X11DPH-T Extended ATX Socket P Motherboard for sale online | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Supermicro X11DPH-T Extended ATX Socket P Motherboard at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!

www.ebay.com

...though that has me thinking it's so much compute that I should consider using it as a virtualization host instead and virtualize my NAS. Maybe not right away, though.

 

[Ericloewe]

Scope creep!