My Dream System (I think)

[jgreco]

We will find out. If I need to spend a little more money, yes it will suck because I'd rather buy more RAM but I'll deal with it.

Actually, thinkin' about it some more, better idea, talk to me first. I've got some Dell H310 sittin' around and I'd be happy to give you one.

 

[Ericloewe]

Well it certainly isn't the cheap side, that's for sure.

Well, duh. Have you ever really looked at the death star? That thing is massively expensive. So expensive, they decided to cut costs by not installing handrails everywhere. That and the cooling solution. Clearly an array of heat dissipation panels was too expensive, so they resorted to the cheap solution that left a big hole along the equator.Pest control was also lacking, as a very new station already had at least one dianoga living in a trash compactor.

In fact, the whole thing is a mess that could only be built in the way it was under a corrupt regime with blatant disregard for occupational safety. An OSHA inspector would have a heart attack inspecting the place.

 

[joeschmuck]

Dell H310

How different is it compared to the M1015 card? If it's not much of a difference and I can still upgrade the firmware over time, I'm also willing to pay for card. But first let me get the parts I ordered in the door and I need to read up on this stuff a bit more. Right now I'm thinking that if I can pass through all the ports on the PCH controller (that is a big if), then I could just install a small 2 port SATA card I have in the basement. Right now though I'm not certain I can pass through the MB ports like I want to but I'm going to give it a go.

 

[joeschmuck]

Well, duh. Have you ever really looked at the death star? That thing is massively expensive. So expensive, they decided to cut costs by not installing handrails everywhere. That and the cooling solution. Clearly an array of heat dissipation panels was too expensive, so they resorted to the cheap solution that left a big hole along the equator.Pest control was also lacking, as a very new station already had at least one dianoga living in a trash compactor.

In fact, the whole thing is a mess that could only be built in the way it was under a corrupt regime with blatant disregard for occupational safety. An OSHA inspector would have a heart attack inspecting the place.

You have no idea how much that brings back memories of submarine life. Overpriced, Pest Control, Trash Compactor, and blatant disregard for OSHA standards.

 

[jgreco]

How different is it compared to the M1015 card? If it's not much of a difference and I can still upgrade the firmware over time, I'm also willing to pay for card. But first let me get the parts I ordered in the door and I need to read up on this stuff a bit more. Right now I'm thinking that if I can pass through all the ports on the PCH controller (that is a big if), then I could just install a small 2 port SATA card I have in the basement. Right now though I'm not certain I can pass through the MB ports like I want to but I'm going to give it a go.

Well, it fits my relative opinion of Dell and IBM... IBM makes the nice stuff whereas Dell makes kinda crud. Both cards are basically the same from a FreeNAS PoV, but the Dell card has a crappy bracket and is a @$&@#$ to crossflash, whereas the IBM has a nice bracket and is very easy. The Dell cards are more like an actual LSI 9211-8i whereas the IBM's are more like the 9220-8i.

 

[Mirfster]

So does that mean you will have the H310 already crossflashed before delivery? :)

Just had to take two extra steps when crossflashing a H200 yesterday. Had to first apply Dell's firmware, then LSI's P07 version; then I could get the P20 done. All was done back to back without rebooting. In the end it all worked just fine. Supposedly, there is a Dell version that is IT mode and some say works a little better, but I never went looking for it.

 

[joeschmuck]

Well I'm still going to just try to use the ports on the MB and see where that leads me before making the decision about adding an HBA. If I can make it work, I'll open a new thread and describe each step required to get it done. If it fails as I'm unfortunately expecting, well I'll get and HBA.

 

[jgreco]

Just had to take two extra steps when crossflashing a H200 yesterday. Had to first apply Dell's firmware, then LSI's P07 version; then I could get the P20 done. All was done back to back without rebooting. In the end it all worked just fine. Supposedly, there is a Dell version that is IT mode and some say works a little better, but I never went looking for it.

Yes, taking it across with the P07 firmware and tool is the critical part of the process, which makes it a real PITA. The H310 also sports a fun thing where the SMBus can screw with your system, doesn't seem to affect most server platforms but it results in the cards being unbootable on the desktop boxes we have in the shop to do stuff like crossflash work. Need to kill off the PCIe B5 and B6 pins. Well documented around the Internet. But an HBA is an HBA...

 

[jgreco]

Well I'm still going to just try to use the ports on the MB and see where that leads me before making the decision about adding an HBA. If I can make it work, I'll open a new thread and describe each step required to get it done. If it fails as I'm unfortunately expecting, well I'll get and HBA.

Yeah, seriously, drop me a line if you need one. We picked up a bunch but I ended up not really caring for the solid bracket. Almost all the work we do here is rackmount and it is all about the airflow. So they've been sitting idle while I look for ways to get rid of them. Happy to give you one, a fair trade for all the times you've made me laugh.

 

[joeschmuck]

Happy to give you one, a fair trade for all the times you've made me laugh.

Well at least I'm able to get you to laugh with my antics.

BTW, I was reading the stickies, yes I did read those, on the virtualization and they made perfect sense to me, well the ideas that is. I have more to read of course, I didn't make it through all those pages, actually I think the most important parts were in the first page of the threads.

 

[jgreco]

I wouldn't suffer through all the pages. I deliberately tell people the important stuff up front. If you can build a FreeNAS system and follow all the little bits of advice about how to do it well, then you can also build an ESXi system and have success. It's just a larger house of cards, and just as with FreeNAS itself, you can't just do ${RANDOM_SH*T} and wind up with success.

 

[joeschmuck]

Parts will not be to my house until Monday evening at the earliest. No fun until Tuesday unless I take a day off from work, or maybe work half the day, I've got tons of vacation I need to take.

 

[Ericloewe]

Parts will not be to my house until Monday evening at the earliest. No fun until Tuesday unless I take a day off from work, or maybe work half the day, I've got tons of vacation I need to take.

Still not as depressing as having everything but the custom-sized SATA cables sitting behind you for a month waiting for enough free time...

 

[Rand]

Oh man, here I was having decided to refresh my FreeNas Box and move the old box to Sophos and now you come and plant some ESX ideas in my ahead ;)
Given the issues I have with VirtualBox VMs i might follow you on that dark path after all. Still not sure whether I am comfortable with the one box solution though.

 

[joeschmuck]

Well my goal is to use ESXi and I'm going to give it a go. Just to let you know, I also have a router pre-configured to replace my Sophos, just turn off my Sophos machine and turn on the router and instant internet. I planned that for when I'm not home and the wife or daughter have some issue, it's an easy fix. So I'm saying I have a fall-back in case Sophos doesn't work initially as planned. Also, My original FreeNAS server will not be harmed while doing all the testing. I will use a some older hard drives and create a pool with the same shares, just a smaller capacity, but I plan to have it all running and leave it that way for 1 month or so. If there are no issues, I'm all in. The only thing that is really important to the family is the internet so as long as I can provide that, I'll stay out of hot water.

Also, I've heard other folks have done this sort of thing without issue. I think the big thing to realize is your system will be as stable is you not constantly screwing around with it. I'm sure I'll reboot the system a few times in the beginning but once I have things situated, hopefully the computer will be running without a reboot at all, well except for when I shut it down to perform maintenance like replacing a fan, dusting out the interior, replacing a hard drive. Otherwise, I have no intentions to turn it off. There are things I need to test such as a proper shutdown when the UPS signals for it, that will be key to me. Like I said, others have done it properly so I'm sure I can as well. Plus there are folks here that will be more than happy to tell me where I'm screwing up.

If you go down this rabbit hole, my advice is to not use your FreeNAS hard drives, use an older drive that you can spare for testing until you have the system running as expected. BTW, I backed up all my data from my FreeNAS pool to other storage so if something bad does happen, I'm still safe, just unhappy of course.

But first I'm waiting on that CPU and RAM to show up, tomorrow is when it should arrive, unfortunately someone must be here to sign for the package, I hope someone is here. The UPS idiots are never consistent on delivery times.

 

[Rand]

Hm, good points.

I do have a full off-site backup just in case but taking it slowly definetly makes sense. I will wait and see how you're doing - the planned X11 board is still 3 weeks out and not even sure it will run ESX yet.

Good luck with your package:)

 

[Frallan]

Damn it Joe! I had all but decided not to virtualize my install as it is my first FreeNAS installation and now you're making me doubt myself.

Off to Ebay to look for a M1015 I suppose..

 

[jgreco]

Damn it Joe! I had all but decided not to virtualize my install as it is my first FreeNAS installation and now you're making me doubt myself.

Off to Ebay to look for a M1015 I suppose..

That Joe is such a schmuck.

Probably one of the most important points that he addressed is attitude towards the gear. The moment you stop treating ESXi like a big variant of VMware Workstation on a desktop and instead start treating it as a serious bit of gear requiring respect and proper treatment, including selecting the right hardware for it, the outcomes for VM's in general become very good.

Sounds a little like FreeNAS in that way, eh?

 

[Frallan]

That Joe is such a schmuck.

Probably one of the most important points that he addressed is attitude towards the gear. The moment you stop treating ESXi like a big variant of VMware Workstation on a desktop and instead start treating it as a serious bit of gear requiring respect and proper treatment, including selecting the right hardware for it, the outcomes for VM's in general become very good.

Sounds a little like FreeNAS in that way, eh?

Indeed it does. The sad part is that few other communities are as careful about hardware selection, burn-in etc. as the FreeNAS community.

 

[joeschmuck]

@Frallan
I wouldn't suggest using ESXi or anything to virtualize FreeNAS unless you are certain you know what you're getting into. I clearly understand the risks I'm taking and it could be another month before I commit my current FreeNAS pool to the new machine. I need to know for certain that I'm making the right choice for my environment and that the hardware reacts as I expect. I can already tell you the the X11 boards are going to have some growing pains just because there are things which do not work as expected so I'll be hitting two walls with my project, the X11 board and ESXi.

If you are only really searching right now for a good quality NAS, I'd recommend you start with getting FreeNAS to run well on your hardware first. If you really want to take a stab at virtualizing it, just take your time and try to understand everything you are doing, get ESXi working properly before installing FreeNAS on it.

As @jgreco said, it's all about keeping the proper attitude and respect towards your system, otherwise you're in for a rough ride.