Advice on HDD upgrade.

[MichaelBatz]

I am running out of space, so time for an upgrade! But before i storm out and buy and bunch of hard drives, i want to ask for some advice first.

This is my server in its current state.

Motherboard:
Supermicro X10SL7-F
CPU:
i3-4330 Processor (4M Cache, 3.50 GHz)
RAM:
2xCrucial 8GB DDR3 PC3-12800 Unbuffered ECC 1.35V 1024Meg x 72 (CT102472BD160B)
2xSamsung DDR3-1600 8GB/1Gx72 ECC CL11 (M391B1G73QH0-YK0)
Power supply:
SeaSonic G-450 GOLD 80Plus – 450W
HDD's:
4xWestern Digital Red NAS Hard Drive WD30EFRX 3TB
Case:
Fractal Design Node 804

I want to fully populate the LSI 2308(IT mode) controller on the Mobo, therefore I need 4 HDD's more. I have 2 HDD's in my NAS (Seagate ST3000DM001).

First question:
If i buy 2xWD RED 3TB and mix them with my Seagate HDD's. How will that perform?

WD Red 3TB: 5400 RPM, 64 MB cache, 4K sector.
Seagate 3TB: 7200 RPM, 64 MB cache, 4K sector.

Second question(s):
My HDD's is setup in a "raidz-1" configuration. When i buy the new HDD's, should i just add them as a vdev(raidz-1) to the zpool? Or make another zpool (raidz-1)?

Bonus question!
I have been thinking about. Connect the new HDD's the my PC. Transfer everything from my server to my PC. Destroy my zpool, create a new zpool(raidz-2) with 8 HDD's. How will that be performance wise? Right now, i can cap my NIC when i trasnfer files. Scrubs is around 270MB/s.

Best regards.

Michael Batz

 

[SweetAndLow]

1. Mixing drives in a vdev results in performance being that of the slowest drive. Do 5400rpm.

2. You probably want a new vdev not a new pool.

Bonus. You are going to want to do this. Z1 isn't a safe way to have your disks configured. You can't directly connect them to your computer because your os probably doesn't understand zfs but you can copy the data over the network then rebuild your pool. You should also have a backup of some kind also.

 

[MichaelBatz]

1. Would you suggest that i try to sell my 2 Seagate HDD's? Or what about keeping them as cold spares?

2. But if one my vdev's fail in my zpool, my entire zpool fails. So why not just a new zpool?

Bonus. Don't know what i was thinking with the whole backup thing, makes no sense :D But i will definitely go for the raidz-2 configuration.

 

[toadman]

1. Just keep them and use them. They will work fine.
2. Because then you would have two zpools that are prone to fail instead of one. And each would be performing worse than the single zpool with two vdevs.

Yes, go for the raidz2. it's the right call.

 

[MichaelBatz]

Thanks for the replies!

I will definitely be going with the raidz-2 configuration. Therefore i need a temporary backup solution, or maybe better yet, a permanent one. I have considered the following.

1) Get an external USB HDD ~6TB. Do monthly backup of my most critical data. Once a month test the HDD for any silent errors.

2) Get cloud storage. I tried out Hubic, where you can get 10TB for 5€, but the speed, ~2MB/s upload!!

3) Not a permanent one. I have found this guy, who sells 3x3TB Hitachi SAS, for 1800kr.(270$). I would then have, 9x3TB (4xWD Red, 2xSeagte, 3xHitachi SAS). With this solution, i could temporary backup my data, as i only need 8 HDD's. (I have 2x2TB in my PC). After the backup, i would have a cold spare. I like this solution, but all the mixing of HDD's, kind of worries me.

 

[MichaelBatz]

Okay. I decided to go with this. I'm buying a 3TB HDD from a friend of mine, to use as a temporary backup, afterwards to be used as a cold spare. Then i will buy 2xWD Red 3TB, configure raidz-2. Subscribe to 10TB at Hubic, let it upload my data for over a month, and then, a good night sleep :D

 

[joeschmuck]

So you are going to save off your data to one of those 3TB drives you got from your friend, then destroy your current vdev and add 2 more 3TB drives (making a total of six 3TB drives) and create a RAID-Z2 vdev giving you about 10 TB of storage. Did I understand that correctly?

This doesn't meet your goal listed above about maxing out with 8 drives but that is okay, people change their minds.

Just out of curiosity, is this for a business or purely for home use? I'm trying to comprehend (not that it's any of my business) why you need to backup to the cloud up to 10TB of data, that is substantial and I can relate to the 2Mbps upload speed, it is very slow. I only backup to the cloud (to my local ISP or to Google Drive) my important data, which is also encrypted. I do not upload videos that I may have on my NAS but rather toss a copy of those to an external USB hard drive for safe keeping. Google Drive gives you 15GB of free storage per account.

Speaking of the 2Mbps upload speed (you said above it was 2MB/sec but I suspect you meant 2Mbps, there is a big difference), did you calculate out how long it will take you. 1TB will take you approximately 50 continuous days to upload (this is a rough estimate). If you did in fact mean 2MB/sec, I want that connection! Just some food for thought.

 

[MichaelBatz]

Not exactly. I'm going to buy 1 HDD from a friend of mine, and 2 new WD Red 3TB. I will backup of my most dear data to my PC, where i currently have 2x2TB plus 3TB soon. The 2 new WD Red plus my 2 Seagate HDD's from my NAS is going into my server, where i will create a raidz-2 from 8x3TB in total.

This is purely for home use. I kind of like my data, and i have tried to lose it all before, so better safe than sorry.

It's 2 MB/s (I'm an IT-engineer student, if i couldn't tell the difference, maybe i should find another field :D ) But, i have been monitoring it for a little while. The speed fluctuates between 2-8 MB/s. Mostly steady around 4.5 MB/s. I have even seen peaks over 10 MB/s. So i will definitely be using this to backup all my data. (idk if this is advertising??)

Some thoughts: I'm doing a lot of random reads, and i have maxed out my Mobo RAM(32GB). I have considered for some time to upgrade my SSD in my PC. It's a corsair 128 GB. And then use that is as a L2ARC. Any inputs??

 

[joeschmuck]

I'm jealous, wish I had 4.5MB/s upload speed. I guess I'd seriously consider encrypted cloud storage too for my entire NAS if I had that kind of speed.

With respect to your RAM and L2ARC... Random reads will never be assisted by more RAM or L2ARC simply because they are random reads and they cannot be cached. If it were data which you repeatedly accessed (like a database or spreadsheet), then that would benefit. 32GB or RAM is very generous for a home system. Also an L2ARC will only slow your system down if you have a lot of random reads. The slow down is measurable however it's so minor that you likely will never notice it.

So my strong advice is to not add an L2ARC. I've been down that path years ago and you will see many postings about people thinking an L2ARC is the cure, it isn't for 99% of home users. You might consider using that 120GB SSD as the boot device. You can manipulate it to also storing your jails on it and then lighten the load on your hard drives, eventually sleeping them if you like. I personally like mine spinning all the time, provides faster initial access but more importantly I'm hoping they last 5 years.

Yea, I didn't follow that you would actually end up with the eight 3TB drives. It's a lot of storage.

For myself, data like photos, videos, etc... are all backed up to DVD media, well depending on the video I may back that up to an external USB hard drive. Family photos are definitely on DVD media.

Good luck on your upgrade and enjoy it.