X11SSM(-F) FreeNAS Build. On the right track?

[snorkleboy13]

It's time to upgrade an old home NAS setup utilizing ReadyNAS NV+ devices. I'm going the build-it-myself route and am in component selection mode right now. Please share your thoughts:

Case - Fractal Design Node 804 No Power Supply MicroATX Cube Case FD-CA-NODE-804-BL, Black
Motherboard - Supermicro Micro ATX DDR4 LGA 1151 Motherboards X11SSM-F-O
Drives - Probably these - WD Red 6TB NAS Hard Disk Drive - 5400 RPM Class SATA 6 Gb/s 64MB Cache 3.5 Inch - WD60EFRX

This system will be used primarily for storage of media files and backup of existing home systems. I will start out with 4 drives and then build out to 8. There will typically be 1-2 computers / devices accessing the system 90% of the time and 2-3 10% of the time.

My question -> What are your recommendations for CPU / Memory that will work well with the X11SSM-F and my use case without over-buying (e.g. spending money for performance that I won't really use.)

 

[Jailer]

If you don't plan on a lot if transcoding via Plex then the Pentium G4560 is what I'd go for. Great bang for buck and won't leave you wanting more.

As far as storage goes, plan your pool ahead of time before you set it up. Check out the ZFS primer in the resources section at the top of the page for more info.

 

[snorkleboy13]

Thanks. I will read the ZFS primer today.

I was looking at these. Pro - Con?

Intel 3.70 GHz Core i3-6100 3M Cache Processor (BX80662I36100)
vs
Intel Xeon E3-1225 V5 Quad-Core Skylake Processor 3.3GHz 8.0GT/s 8MB LGA 1151 CPU, Retail or
Intel XEON E3-1220V5 3.00GHZ SKT1151 8MB CACHE BOXED, BX80662E31220V5 (SKT1151 8MB CACHE BOXED)

Would the I3 be OK with some transcoding?
Would the Xeon be overkill or a good investment to future proof the system (well, for a while)?

Thx.

 

[Jailer]

The G4560 has the same number of cores/threads as the i3, is 200Mhz slower and $40 cheaper and built on a slightly faster architecture. That's why I suggested it.

Do you plan on running Plex? If so are your clients direct play compatible? Do you plan on remote streaming? If remote streaming do you plan on multiple remote streams? These are all questions that need answering before a solid CPU recommendation can be given since you said:

(e.g. spending money for performance that I won't really use.)

 

[snorkleboy13]

First - Thanks for being patient with me.

I do plan on running Plex. The clients are all Macs (one iMac that does 1080, several MBAs that handle 1080 just fine plus one Samsung Smart TV that works with Plex). Still I expect there might be some transcoding to smaller devices at times.

Remote streaming would be on occasion when I'm traveling, but it would just be me.

 

[Jailer]

Then the G4650 I recommended would be more than enough. The Xeon for that use case would be overkill and money better spent elsewhere.

For memory search the forums for the Crucial part numbers being used by other members with success. There are enough X11SSM-F-O builds out there now that finding what's working shouldn't be difficult.

 

[joeschmuck]

I would like to ask a few questions just to ensure @snorkleboy13 is considering everything up front.

When you are talking about Plex transcoding, what would be your source material format? Are you looking at DVD quality, Blue Ray, or 4K? The higher the quality of the video, the more CPU horsepower you will need and more storage of course. But if you're like me, I only retain movie video content in ripped format for movies I know that I will watch again, not content to impress my buds when they come over to drink a beer.

Do you have any remote plans to run VMs on your FreeNAS system? This is kind of a new feature and will be supported much better in FreeNAS 11.1 (we all hope). If this is a possibility then you may want a faster CPU and more RAM, however RAM can typically be added at a later date. Since I didn't see you specify how much RAM you wanted, I'll suggest you start with a single 16GB RAM stick. This allows you to upgrade up to 64GB if you feel the need. 16GB RAM is also the minimum I'd recommend for FreeNAS 11.

As for hard drive storage, you mentioned above that you wanted to start with 4 hard drives and raise it to 8 drives at a later date. You need to fully understand how you are able to expand your capacity and the do's and don't's of ZFS which is why @Jailer pointed you to the ZFS Primer. Understand that you just can't (or shouldn't) add a drive to your pool without risk. Of course I'm assumign you are going to create a RAIDZ2 but that is a bad assumption since you didn't state it. So ensure that you understand how you would expand your drive capacity and the pitfalls of doing it incorrectly, as too many people do and then ask for help to recover and it's a bleak answer.

I noticed in your amazon link for the I3 CPU that amazon has some added selling features suggesting you may want to buy a heatsink with the CPU. Don't fall for it. The boxed CPU should come with an Intel heatsink/fan which will work very well and quiet. And I'm not saying buy the I3 or G4650, I think knowing more about the source media will help and if you plan to do any VM work.

Jumping back to Plex, if you presently are not using Plex and all your media plays fine on your devices then that means that your devices are handling any transcoding needed and this does lighten up the load on your CPU. All my player devices handle transcoding internally, I just did a quick test and my CPU speed barely moved except when I was scanning through a movie. So in my home even though Plex will transcode, it doesn't need to since my players all support the video format I'm using. I could use a DLNA server and all would be fine in my home but I do like the added info and screens that Plex provides.

 

[snorkleboy13]

When you are talking about Plex transcoding, what would be your source material format? Are you looking at DVD quality, Blue Ray, or 4K? The higher the quality of the video, the more CPU horsepower you will need and more storage of course. But if you're like me, I only retain movie video content in ripped format for movies I know that I will watch again, not content to impress my buds when they come over to drink a beer.

80% Standard DVD content in .ISO, .AVI and other similar formats. 20% BD content. Playback will be in the original format unless streamed to phones or tablets. Streaming to phones will be a new endeavor for me as I used to transcode manually and then load onto the phone for trips.

Do you have any remote plans to run VMs on your FreeNAS system? This is kind of a new feature and will be supported much better in FreeNAS 11.1 (we all hope). If this is a possibility then you may want a faster CPU and more RAM, however RAM can typically be added at a later date. Since I didn't see you specify how much RAM you wanted, I'll suggest you start with a single 16GB RAM stick. This allows you to upgrade up to 64GB if you feel the need. 16GB RAM is also the minimum I'd recommend for FreeNAS 11.

I have no immediate plans for remote VMs. I plan on starting with 16GB of memory and adding more later if I need it.

As for hard drive storage, you mentioned above that you wanted to start with 4 hard drives and raise it to 8 drives at a later date. You need to fully understand how you are able to expand your capacity and the do's and don't's of ZFS which is why @Jailer pointed you to the ZFS Primer. Understand that you just can't (or shouldn't) add a drive to your pool without risk. Of course I'm assumign you are going to create a RAIDZ2 but that is a bad assumption since you didn't state it. So ensure that you understand how you would expand your drive capacity and the pitfalls of doing it incorrectly, as too many people do and then ask for help to recover and it's a bleak answer.

I've read the primer and some related resource material. I believe my best bet is to utilize RAIDZ2 and install 6 drives right away. Agree?

I noticed in your amazon link for the I3 CPU that amazon has some added selling features suggesting you may want to buy a heatsink with the CPU. Don't fall for it. The boxed CPU should come with an Intel heatsink/fan which will work very well and quiet. And I'm not saying buy the I3 or G4650, I think knowing more about the source media will help and if you plan to do any VM work.

Understand. As I haven't ordered anything yet, I have total flexibility.

Jumping back to Plex, if you presently are not using Plex and all your media plays fine on your devices then that means that your devices are handling any transcoding needed and this does lighten up the load on your CPU. All my player devices handle transcoding internally, I just did a quick test and my CPU speed barely moved except when I was scanning through a movie. So in my home even though Plex will transcode, it doesn't need to since my players all support the video format I'm using. I could use a DLNA server and all would be fine in my home but I do like the added info and screens that Plex provides.

I do use Plex at times, but have held off on standardizing on it as my current ReadyNAS devices are close to 10 years old and are a little iffy.

Thx.

 

[joeschmuck]

I believe my best bet is to utilize RAIDZ2 and install 6 drives right away. Agree?

Are you still planning to increase the drive count to 8? If that is a yes answer then you do not understand ZFS or you plan to backup all your data, destroy your pool, add the two drives for a total of 8, create a new pool, and finally copy all your data back to the dataset(s). Another option for you, if you do not have all the money for the last two hard drives, if you have any capacity hard drives you could install those and then replace these once you can afford to buy new hard drives however the pool size will be limited to the smallest capacity drive. If you have 6TB drives and one 500GB drive, the pool will be treated as if all the drives were 500GB. Once you replace the 500GB drive with a 6TB drive, all the drives will be treated as 6TB drives. I'm simplifying it for you but that is basically how it works.

Lets talk capacity... How much storage do you desire to have?

When I ask about capacity I am trying to make the person think about what they want realistically for capacity over the warranty period of the hard drives and maybe add 1 year if you buy drives which have been proven to be reliable (my WD Red 2TB drives are getting close to a 5 years constant running time, much better than anticipated). Here is the formula I like to use (I pulled it out of my rear of course): Capacity you think you need for the next 3 years and multiply that x2, + 20%. So lets use the drives you selected above and see what the total usable capacity will be... Eight 6TB drives (48TB RAW capacity) in a RAIDZ2 = 32.7TB of usable space, subtract 2GB for each drive for the swap space (16GB) = 32.6TB, subtract 20% to maintain a healthy pool (6.52TB) = 26.08TB of actual usable space without compression. It's amazing how fast it droped from 32.7TB down to 26.08TB.

So, is 26TB of storage enough for the next 3 to 4 years? If your answer is yes then you are good to go.

 

[snorkleboy13]

@joeschmuck - I think I understand ZFS. 6 drives would give me 4 data drives and 2 parity drives using ZRAID2 within a single vdev, correct?

My total data needs right now are less than 8TB, so I should have decent room to grow for the next 3-5 years. If I go above that..... I guess it will be time to build another one.

 

[joeschmuck]

@joeschmuck - I think I understand ZFS. 6 drives would give me 4 data drives and 2 parity drives using ZRAID2 within a single vdev, correct?

My total data needs right now are less than 8TB, so I should have decent room to grow for the next 3-5 years. If I go above that..... I guess it will be time to build another one.

Very cool. I hope your experience is a good one. For me, I was in on the ground floor for FreeNAS 8 and there was a lot of learning going on and the program was not made for the weekend computer nerd, it was more so for the avid IT guy/gal. Things have been simplified quite a bit however you cannot simplify the way FreeBSD and ZFS works, you just need to buckle down and figure it out.

Enjoy FreeNAS and if/when you have any problems, ensure to post all your system specs and FreeNAS version so we can provide a timely and accurate answer.

Cheers!

 

[diedrichg]

If I recall correctly, the Xeon xxx5 chips have integrated graphics. If you are going with a board with IPMI, save yourself a few dollars and go with the xxx0 version.

 

[Stux]

@joeschmuck - I think I understand ZFS. 6 drives would give me 4 data drives and 2 parity drives using ZRAID2 within a single vdev, correct?

Raidz2 ;)

(lets not quibble about capitalization and punctuation)

My total data needs right now are less than 8TB, so I should have decent room to grow for the next 3-5 years. If I go above that..... I guess it will be time to build another one.

Or add another six drives ;)

 

[snorkleboy13]

Raidz2 ;)

Must be my Lysdexia ;)

 

[Stux]

Must be my Lysdexia ;)

Dem zeds sneak into everything.

edit: poll idea: Zed Eff Ess ;)

 

[Ericloewe]

Dem zeds sneak into everything.

edit: poll idea: Zed Eff Ess ;)

Allan Jude had a few special copies of his ZFS books printed that replaced every instance of "ZFS" with "Zed Eff Ess" (or something like that) and auctioned them off with the proceeds going to a good cause.

 

[religiouslyconfused]

I use that motherboard, and it works great for FreeNAS! :)

 

[snorkleboy13]

Sooooooooo, I received all of the parts except for the drives, laid everything out and started to put things together. Power supply in case - Check. Move to the motherboard and get ready to install the RAM and ran into a L I T T L E problem. Note to Crucial - Maybe don't ship RAM in a lightly padded envelope. RMA in process.

 

[Jailer]

Ouch! They should take care of that but it sucks having to wait for the replacement.

 

[Ericloewe]

What a waste of 18 perfectly good DDR4 chips...