Lots of noob’s questions inside

[mjt5282]

Thank you.

The Dell card looks great value for the $$$ spent. For around $30-$50, I can get an improvement (speed + reliability) over the mobo-connected SATA drives. Am I correct?

4 questions here:
1. Does IronWolf NAS 8TB drive (ST8000VN004 one) is a good choice for NAS? Can't wait to order them.

2. AMD vs Intel in terms of NAS. I do realize that this is a big question and potentially it can start a "holy war" (that's NOT my intention). I went through SuperMicro mobos and Xeon CPUs. In general, that's an easy $2k price tag while AMD combo is well under $1k. I guess, my question is - do I really need to pay that extra? In other words, does AMD server more than twice worse (less reliable or smth else?) than its Intel counterpart?

3. For an AMD-based server - does X570 is a good choice? Is there anything better than that?

4. From what I already saw (keep looking tho), I have 2 mobos which are appealing to me:
- ASRock X570D4U-2L2T (https://www.asrockrack.com/general/productdetail.asp?Model=X570D4U-2L2T#Specifications)
- Asus Pro WS X570-ACE (https://www.asus.com/Commercial-Servers-Workstations/Pro-WS-X570-ACE/overview/)
Any other mobos which would be good for me?
I guess gaming/desktop mobos are not appropriate for my scenario.

My only recommendation on buying new hard drives is, make sure they are CMR and not SMR, *especially* if you are doing a raidz1/raidz2 configuration. Seagate makes fine CMR drives, as does WD (now branded as WD Red Plus, i believe).

It used to be several years ago that AMD CPUs were not as well supported by freebsd kernels, and freebsd is what TrueNas uses under the hood. My systems (built several years plus ago all use Intel Xeon CPUs/Supermicro motherboards . My feeling is that freebsd has 'caught' up with AMD support. If you buy a AMD CPU/motherboard, keep a careful eye on motherboard sleep/wait settings. I happen to be thinking of building a new server system, tempted to look at AMD now, write it up and let us know how it goes if you go AMD route. Good luck!

 

[starche.old]

Quick question here.

While Ryzen 3000 series does not have integrated graphics, do I need to have a separate video card to run a NAS?

 

[ThreeDee]

Quick question here.

While Ryzen 3000 series does not have integrated graphics, do I need to have a separate video card to run a NAS?

depends on the motherboard .. I run the X470D4U and it has a separate onboard video chip and IPMI port so I don't really need the onboard video to setup.. but if you run a regular non-server motherboard ..then yes, you will need a video card .. at least for initial setup and some motherboards don't play nice if there is no video card installed if you want to run headless afterwards

 

[starche.old]

depends on the motherboard .. I run the X470D4U and it has a separate onboard video chip and IPMI port so I don't really need the onboard video to setup.. but if you run a regular non-server motherboard ..then yes, you will need a video card .. at least for initial setup and some motherboards don't play nice if there is no video card installed if you want to run headless afterwards

I'm planning to get X570D4U-2L2T. With this mobo I should be fine than?

 

[ThreeDee]

I'm planning to get X570D4U-2L2T. With this mobo I should be fine than?

heck yeah, lol.. the more I play with this X470D4U .. the more I go "Wow" .. "Niiiice" .. with the IPMI and remote KVM it just makes stuff that wasn't necessarily hard before .. sooooooper easy ..

I have TrueNAS installed on it now with another M.2 drive installed with Plex and Unifi6 Controller for testing. I haven't put the board in my case with all my drives yet. I noticed the dashboard was saying some pretty warm numbers from my 3700x but when I log into the motherboard via IPMI and check the temps . .they were showing a good 10c cooler. The Dashboard will say "Hottest 51c" ..then it will say "Hottest 34c" . .. and bounce around. I'll check the CPU temp graph and it will say 41c was the max , so I don't know. That has been the only kind of off thing.

My 3700x is running the stock Wraith cooler but will get the Noctua NH-U12S when I switch it out with my current setup (I originally got the cooler for my desktop..AM4 setup... before going to the NH-D15 and Noctua sent me free LGA2011 mounts to install on my server setup)

 

[starche.old]

My only recommendation on buying new hard drives is, make sure they are CMR and not SMR, *especially* if you are doing a raidz1/raidz2 configuration. Seagate makes fine CMR drives, as does WD (now branded as WD Red Plus, i believe).

It used to be several years ago that AMD CPUs were not as well supported by freebsd kernels, and freebsd is what TrueNas uses under the hood. My systems (built several years plus ago all use Intel Xeon CPUs/Supermicro motherboards . My feeling is that freebsd has 'caught' up with AMD support. If you buy a AMD CPU/motherboard, keep a careful eye on motherboard sleep/wait settings. I happen to be thinking of building a new server system, tempted to look at AMD now, write it up and let us know how it goes if you go AMD route. Good luck!

Yesterday I've ordered those drives I mentioned earlier. ETA is today (really?) or tomorrow (much more realistic). Can't wait to get my hands dirty

I'm not sure about FreeBSD, but in the Linux world, AMD support nowadays is very similar to Intel (my mark for both of them is "excellent"). However, a few years back AMD was nowhere close to that. That's why I didn't even bother to check the AMD world. I was deeply in the "blue" world. Until now...

I still checked SuperMicro and Xeon prices, but that's completely out of lunch. I can get workstation mobo and non-Xeon, but... 8 core CPU sounds plausible to me. Ryzen 7 3700X for now and we'll see how it will do. Maybe I'll flip it to 5800 one - if I'll feel I need to do so.

I think I'm sold on that AMD board. For sure I'll post here the process and the results. I'm pretty sure that I will bug you guys with few questions here and there. I'll try to be short and do my homework first before posting any stupid questions.

 

[starche.old]

heck yeah, lol.. the more I play with this X470D4U .. the more I go "Wow" .. "Niiiice" .. with the IPMI and remote KVM it just makes stuff that wasn't necessarily hard before .. sooooooper easy ..

I have TrueNAS installed on it now with another M.2 drive installed with Plex and Unifi6 Controller for testing. I haven't put the board in my case with all my drives yet. I noticed the dashboard was saying some pretty warm numbers from my 3700x but when I log into the motherboard via IPMI and check the temps . .they were showing a good 10c cooler. The Dashboard will say "Hottest 51c" ..then it will say "Hottest 34c" . .. and bounce around. I'll check the CPU temp graph and it will say 41c was the max , so I don't know. That has been the only kind of off thing.

My 3700x is running the stock Wraith cooler but will get the Noctua NH-U12S when I switch it out with my current setup (I originally got the cooler for my desktop..AM4 setup... before going to the NH-D15 and Noctua sent me free LGA2011 mounts to install on my server setup)

That's what I'm doing then.

Thank you guys for all your help.


One question about RAM. mjt5282 recommends 16GB, but I'm thinking to get 32GB instead. It won't hurt plus gives some peace of mind if in some time in the future I'll need more RAM, I can potentially have 128GB for the server. I'm thinking of getting a single 32GB stick - KINGSTON 32GB 3200MHz DDR4 ECC CL22 DIMM 2Rx8 Micron E (KSM32ED8/32ME) (https://www.amazon.ca/KINGSTON-3200MHz-Micron-KSM32ED8-32ME/dp/B08GKVFMGN). Is that a good stick? Or should look for something better?

I do realize that it's better to use both banks instead of one. My question here: is this ECC stick a dual bank (like laptop RAM) one or not? What does "2Rx8" in the stick title mean - dual bank of dual side soldering of the chips?

Other parts of the build I would like you guys to vet.
1. Case - Fractal Design Define XL (https://www.quietpc.com/fd-definexl). It's old and HEAVY, soundproofed and big. Fits up to 10 drives. Is that a good case for NAS? Mobo should fit the case.

2. CPU cooling. Usually, stock coolers are "much more to be desired" (if to be VERY politically correct ). Currently, on my old rig, I have dual tower TR IFX-14 (http://thermalright.com/product/ifx-14/). Aside from really uneven footing (which I had to polish it for quite some time), it's a great cooler. I OC'd my i7-920 till 4.5-4.7 GHz and it was stable in benchmarks and 4.0-4.2 GHz as a daily driver. But this cooler is very old, with no support for the AM4 socket.
I'm thinking of Noctua NH-D15 (https://noctua.at/en/nh-d15). Should be good, right? The plan is to try to run a 65W CPU without the fans. But I need to figure out how to monitor temps in FreeBSD. Any tips on which direction I need to look at?

3. PSU. Enermax Revolution 850W Bronze. It's old, but works. Should be sufficient.

Does all that make sense?

Update. Drives just arrived while I was writing this post. I'm excited!

 

[ThreeDee]

I run the NH-D15 . .had to get a deeper case to house it because it's just so huge .. so keep that in mind if you go monster cooler. Something like the Noctua NH-U12S SE-AM4 with dual fans would be a good choice .. or just the Wraith cooler that comes with the 3700x would be sufficient. Of course whatever you go with for a case, make sure you have ample air flow to cool your hard drives and motherboard VRM's & memory.

That IFX-14 would cool things great .. you'd need the AM4 upgrade kit for it

THERMALRIGHT® AMD AM4 CPU Mount Upgrade – Thermalright

thermalright.com

 

[starche.old]

Wow... I can get a kit for AM4. I didn't know they still supporting this IFX-14. Thank you very much.

How's NH-D15 doing? Are you running it fanless?

That's why I like huge cases (and Fractal Design Define XL is one of those) - I don't need to worry about the size of the components, starting with the cooler. Bcoz I like big coolers. Another reason for big cases - even a huge cooler like IFX-14 won't block the airflow.

 

[ThreeDee]

Wow... I can get a kit for AM4. I didn't know they still supporting this IFX-14. Thank you very much.

How's NH-D15 doing? Are you running it fanless?

That's why I like huge cases (and Fractal Design Define XL is one of those) - I don't need to worry about the size of the components, starting with the cooler. Bcoz I like big coolers. Another reason for big cases - even a huge cooler like IFX-14 won't block the airflow.

works great .. but no, running 2 140mm fans on it (5600x cpu) .. my 5700xt blower style video card is louder than the Noctua though .. and it isn't very loud. On a 3700x, I would imagine it would keep the CPU cool enough .. but you need air flow over the memory and VRM's to keep everything else cool.. perhaps not as important on a server as it is on a gaming desktop though

..another thing I've noticed with this new X470D4U setup is that it's always showing whatever hottest degrees Celsius on 16 cores .. whereas my 12core/24thread LGA2011 setup would say whatever hottest degrees Celsius on 2 cores .. or 1 core .. on this AM4 setup, all categories on dashboard say 16 cores all the time.. not an issue, just an observation.

 

[starche.old]

One of the reasons I'd like to build a new rig (aside from everything else) - I wanna get rid of the video card. My ancient GeForce GTX570 is way too loud. Even if it sits in the basement, it's annoying to be around. Putting the server in the utility room and shutting the door helps.

For the cooling - I've got a 180mm fan on top of the case. I hope it will be capable of pulling the hot air out. But sure enough, I'll keep an eye on it, especially the first couple of days. Or maybe I'll leave my 2 low rpm fans and I'll see if it's quite enough.

BTW, how I can monitor the temps in TrueNAS?

 

[ThreeDee]

on the dashboard when you log in .. or log into your new motherboards IPMI and it will display all kinds of goodies

 

[starche.old]

Oh, that's really kewl

 

[starche.old]

on the dashboard when you log in .. or log into your new motherboards IPMI and it will display all kinds of goodies

View attachment 45765

What do you think about X570D4I-2T
(https://www.asrockrack.com/general/productdetail.asp?Model=X570D4I-2T#CPU)?

Is it much worse (from what I can see it's MUCH smaller) than X570D4U-2L2T
(https://www.asrockrack.com/general/productdetail.asp?Model=X570D4U-2L2T#Memory)

 

[ThreeDee]

just depends on what will suit your needs better .. the mini-itx version takes SODIMM's so keep that in mind and the power plugin configuration is a bit different so make sure you have the appropriate connectors/adapters to power the unit..

I'd go for the 2L2T between the 2 personally ..

 

[ChrisRJ]

I still checked SuperMicro and Xeon prices, but that's completely out of lunch. I can get workstation mobo and non-Xeon, but... 8 core CPU sounds plausible to me.

The "trick" here is to go for used gear. I got myself a VM host with 128 GB RAM, an 8-core Xeon and a 1 TB SSD (consumer-grade, though) for about 400 Euros. I don't want to tell you that this more suited for your needs, but mention it to make readers aware of the option.

Enjoy your new gear!

 

[ThreeDee]

The "trick" here is to go for used gear. I got myself a VM host with 128 GB RAM, an 8-core Xeon and a 1 TB SSD (consumer-grade, though) for about 400 Euros. I don't want to tell you that this more suited for your needs, but mention it to make readers aware of the option.

Enjoy your new gear!

Old and used ..even better .. I paid $125 for 32GB of DDR3 ECC RDIMM's, 8core/16thread LGA 2011 cpu, and B75 chipset (x79t)motherboard .. worked great for TrueNAS and never had any issues with the setup .. just a bit power hungry was all.

 

[starche.old]

just depends on what will suit your needs better .. the mini-itx version takes SODIMM's so keep that in mind and the power plugin configuration is a bit different so make sure you have the appropriate connectors/adapters to power the unit..

I'd go for the 2L2T between the 2 personally ..

Thank you. That exactly what I was thinking. Thank you for confirming.

 

[starche.old]

The "trick" here is to go for used gear. I got myself a VM host with 128 GB RAM, an 8-core Xeon and a 1 TB SSD (consumer-grade, though) for about 400 Euros. I don't want to tell you that this more suited for your needs, but mention it to make readers aware of the option.

Enjoy your new gear!

I see what you mean. I can put myself in a bit risky situation - it might not readily available when I need it. Plus why use something old, lower performance against what we have right now, harder to get parts, less power efficient and what costs exactly the same as a new build? Like a few years back I won't even think to build something on AMD, but times are changing...

 

[starche.old]

Installed TrueNAS 12 U2.1 on my old rig. No problem. Added 3 drives (I was hoping to get RAIDZ2 option, but no luck, I guess I need one more drive). Right now 4.2GB of RAM is available of 5.0GB. Not too bad.

I created the pool. Now it's time to add data. I plugged the drive with data, then clicked on import disk and got this error message:

Code:

Error: Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "/usr/local/lib/python3.8/site-packages/middlewared/job.py", line 367, in run
    await self.future
  File "/usr/local/lib/python3.8/site-packages/middlewared/job.py", line 403, in __run_body
    rv = await self.method(*([self] + args))
  File "/usr/local/lib/python3.8/site-packages/middlewared/schema.py", line 973, in nf
    return await f(*args, **kwargs)
  File "/usr/local/lib/python3.8/site-packages/middlewared/plugins/pool_/import_disk.py", line 94, in import_disk
    raise Exception('rsync failed with exit code %r' % rsync_proc.returncode)
Exception: rsync failed with exit code 11

What I'm doing wrong?