Important announcement regarding FreeNAS Corral

[SavageAUS]

Well said @Visseroth
The team behind corral are the only ones I feel for. As you said the people who jumped to corral (including me) have no one to blame for time lost as they knew what the temperature of the water was like in the deep end.
I have my NAS back up and running on 9.10 and it's running just fine with jails (Plex, Sickrage, Couchpotato and transmission) this is what backups are for people!.
I will say to IX Systems and all devs behind corral and FreeNAS in general, Well done on what you have achieved and I for one am looking forward to what future versions of 9.10.x bring to us.
Corral was a great piece of software that yes may have been released too soon but hey, live and learn.
Once you dust yourselves off don't forget to pat yourselves on the back too.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

 

[lukyjay]

This will be done sometime tomorrow. Good suggestion.

So long FreeNAS Vista.. I mean Corral :)

Glad to try FreeNAS 9 for the first time in a few weeks (when 9.10.3 is avail).

 

[WrlsFanatic]

Suggestion: Name the new release track. Just like you gave v10 the "Corral" name, give this some other name. The reason is, if I want to Google guides for people to help with setting things up, it's INCREDIBLY helpful to have something to search for. As it stands, I'll have to Google guides for "9.10.3" or whatever, and putting periods in there isn't great for search engines. It would be a lot easier.

Question 1: I'm 100% happy with Corral. I haven't had a single issue. Will my docker containers still get upgraded, or can I assume they will stop being upgraded as well?

Ask: Please don't leave Corral users stranded. A detailed guide for migrating from Corral back to 9.10.9 (because that's when I assume there will be enough of the Corral features to entice users to switch over) would be extremely helpful. Also, a guide to migrating our Docker containers would be extremely helpful.

 

[lukyjay]

Suggestion: Name the new release track. Just like you gave v10 the "Corral" name, give this some other name.

They likely will. I read something about where the name Corral came from, it's to do with the BSD version number. They were going to stop using numerical version names after the 9 train.

I really liked the name Corral.

 

[danb35]

Unfortunately, it doesn't sound like iX has learned about release engineering. A point release (9.10.2 to 9.10.3) is simply not an appropriate place to introduce a whole new GUI, just as a service update to a point release is not an appropriate place to remove a feature that lots of your users use (like VirtualBox).

 

[silverback]

After fumbling and bumbling around corral for several months I am disappointed that something with so much potential had to be scraped. I had hoped that it would be the quickest path to passing-through a video card with byhve. I hope the development of the 9.10 train will move towards pci-e passthrough. Wouldn't it be interesting to run a home theater box off your NAS.

 

[fracai]

The version numbering does need a revamp. What I recall is that the major number used to track the FreeBSD version FreeNAS was based on (FreeNAS 9.1, 9.2, 9.3 were all based on the respective FreeBSD versions). Then they rebased FreeNAS 9 on FreeBSD 10 leading to a jump from 9.3 to 9.10. Incremental updates have lead us to 9.10.2. And, because four version segments was deemed too long, we gave 9.10.2-SU1 rather than 9.10.2.1

If 9.10.3 is going to rebase on BSD 11 I'd expect FreeNAS 9.11. If they're sticking with the 9.10.3-SU1 format, I think it's fair to consider 9.10 as the major version number, 3 is the minor, and SU1 is the point or "change" release.

Having SU1, SU2 is better than the brief days where there were multiple releases distinguished only by the build date/number.

I'd personally prefer that FreeNAS include a note regarding the FreeBSD version and just track it's own independent numbering (major.minor.change would be equivalent to the current major.freebsd.minor-change). This is similar to how Spring Source versions their release of their Eclipse-based IDE. Throw in a code name for easy searching. Something like "FreeNAS Coop 9.5.3 (FreeBSD 11)".

 

[bestboy]

Unfortunately, it doesn't sound like iX has learned about release engineering. A point release (9.10.2 to 9.10.3) is simply not an appropriate place to introduce a whole new GUI, just as a service update to a point release is not an appropriate place to remove a feature that lots of your users use (like VirtualBox).

quoted for truth.

As a conservative hobby sysadmin, I'm ok with the decision to can Corral and rebase on the stable 9.10 branch.
But as a software engineer I feel like the new FreeBSD 11 base system and the various back ports from Corral should not end up in a point release to 9.10.

 

[Ericloewe]

Unfortunately, it doesn't sound like iX has learned about release engineering. A point release (9.10.2 to 9.10.3) is simply not an appropriate place to introduce a whole new GUI, just as a service update to a point release is not an appropriate place to remove a feature that lots of your users use (like VirtualBox).

Well, the GUI won't be taking over so soon. It's there as a preview of things to come.

There's also some momentum behind naming either 9.10.4 or 9.10.3 FreeNAS 11.

Besides, the 9.10.x series has been tending towards larger releases with each point for a while.

 

[lukyjay]

Is there an ETA For 9.10.3?

 

[Ericloewe]

Mid-May.

 

[NAStyBox]

Well done. I wish more software developers would take this approach. Sometimes completely new isn't the best idea. Especially not with something like storage, which needs to be rock solid stable to preserve data integrity. I have to say that while testing Corral I was becoming uneasy about using it to store data I can't lose. Last night I added 9 virtual drives to a VM of 9.1.x and set it up exactly as I would in production. No weirdness, and everything seemed to work. If it can work that well on VirtualBox, then I'm sure it will be great on my hardware when the rest of my parts show up. Thanks!

 

[Michael Schultz]

quoted for truth.

As a conservative hobby sysadmin, I'm ok with the decision to can Corral and rebase on the stable 9.10 branch.
But as a software engineer I feel like the new FreeBSD 11 base system and the various back ports from Corral should not end up in a point release to 9.10.

They don't have much of a choice. They took away absolute required features and now people can't use FreeNAS because it lacks functionality. If they want people to stop jumping ship they need to get a product with similar features to Corral as soon as humanely possible. All they did with the release of Corral was show their 9.* audience how many features they lack. If Corral doesn't have full docker/vm support and a completed new gui by June, FreeNAS is done for.

 

[Ericloewe]

If corral doesn't have full docker/vm support and a completed new gui by june, freenas is done for.

That is quite a hyperbolic statement.

 

[Michael Schultz]

There has been some in here that have been considerate and some that are outright Pi$$ed.
Both are understandable.

Those that are pissed need to remember that you choose to upgrade to something new, granted and most likely for the features. I don't blame you. Jails have been a bit clunky and the VirtualBox was dropped but it was that way because so much time and work was being put into version 10 aka Corral.
You also need to keep in mind that they didn't make this decision lightly. The carpet was ripped out from under them just as much you, as it was you who upgraded.
They were using MontageJS framework which disbanded which meant the FreeNAS team had to abandon Corral.
They didn't abandon Corral because they weren't up to the challenge, they abandoned Corral because they weren't given a choice! Their large investment of time and money was partially take away from them!

Now is all lost? Heck no! From what I've read some of the improvements that was done in Corral are being moved to version 9. Rejoice you crazy critters! New features are coming that make Jails and VirtualBox look like clunky toys!
Improvements will be made, the FreeNAS team took a hit but they didn't abandon ship, they are wiping off the dust and picking up the pieces!

Unfortunately for those that upgraded to cutting edge stuff they are suffering from some bleeding or time lost but nothing like the FreeNAS/iXsystems team. If you want to run cutting edge then prepare for some bleeding. You knew what you were getting into. You knew there would be bugs at the very least.

So, give the guys some credit, knowing they would pi## people of they posted on here exactly what happened, why they jumped ship on their new baby and what they plan to do to make up for it. They really are trying to provide a quality product for people.

I didn't see a single post from any of the FreeNAS team members here that said "Tough shat bud".

Anyhow, I'm done venting. I just wanted to say thanks to the FreeNAS team for all the hard work. I understand it's been tough and exhausting and there is much more work to be done but know that many out here still support and respect you people and look forward to future stable releases and updates.
You truely do build a remarkable product. I think there's much more work to be done but you're hard on your way.
And no, I'm not kissing butt for anyone that thinks so. I've been a bit pi## and frustrated myself but I also understand.

There is so much wrong with this post... How much did Kris pay you to write that?

There is so much wrong with this post its hard to contain myself. What YOU need to remember is that I didn't install beta software. I installed 1.0 software. Does it need to work perfectly? no. Does releasing 1.0 software mean the software won't be scrapped? yup, 100%. stopping trying to put the blame on me for installing officially released software

They without a doubt made this decision lightly and almost certainly without even a meeting. This decision was made 6 months ago but nobody stood up to Hubbard. This is an absolute fact. Kris knew Corral had no future for the majority of 2016 and told nobody.

1.0 is not cutting edge, 0.1 is.

And no, I did NOT know what I was getting in to. I did not know FreeNAS pulling a release was an option. How can you possibly say I knew what I was getting in to? How many 1.0 software released have been decommisioned in less than a month? Like 7 in history? Stop saying its my fault. this is 100% FreeNAS fault.

 

[WrlsFanatic]

Well done. I wish more software developers would take this approach. Sometimes completely new isn't the best idea. Especially not with something like storage, which needs to be rock solid stable to preserve data integrity.

And sometimes trying to piecemeal updates onto existing versions isn't the answer either. You can end up with Frankenstein code that is so pieced together that competitors can come along with fresh code bases that run MUCH smoother. I'm just saying, there are pros and cons to this approach that I'm sure the team weighed, but for myself and all of the people that are going to have to do a ton of work to resolve this disaster, I'd rather we not suggest that this is 100% the best idea. None of us know if it is.

 

[Jailer]

There is so much wrong with this post... How much did Kris pay you to write that?

Lighten up Francis.

 

[Ericloewe]

And sometimes trying to piecemeal updates onto existing versions isn't the answer either. You can end up with Frankenstein code that is so pieced together that competitors can come along with fresh code bases that run MUCH smoother. I'm just saying, there are pros and cons to this approach that I'm sure the team weighed, but for myself and all of the people that are going to have to do a ton of work to resolve this disaster, I'd rather we not suggest that this is 100% the best idea. None of us know if it is.

True enough. I've been following the work on 9.x for some years now, and a big part of the effort happened with the 9.3 -» 9.10 transition, cleaning things up and such. So I'm not particularly worried about that.

 

[WrlsFanatic]

And no, I did NOT know what I was getting in to. I did not know freenas pulling a release was an option. How can you possibly say I knew what I was getting in to? How many 1.0 software released have been decommisioned in less than a month? Like 7 in history? Stop saying its my fault. this is 100% freenas fault.

Agreed. People keep acting like everyone was on the "bleeding edge". I work at a software company. If we put out a new point release (x + 1).0, our customers ASSUME that it might be buggy but that it's the new direction going forward. I actually worked with a customer that installed our x.0 software. We discussed it and knew that there would be hiccups, but with a new install, it was MUCH preferable to installing the old version knowing that there would be a new setup for everything. In this case, I installed less than 30 days ago. The 10.0 release had been out for awhile. There were reviews posted. Why the hell would I have installed 9.10.x knowing that I'd have to scrap all of my jails and start over with Docker containers in the near future?!

I'm trying not to fly off the handle, I'm just tired of people acting like adopters "should have known". They shouldn't. If someone rolled this out at a company, in a production environment, YES, that was a bad idea. But a company should be paying for TrueNAS, not using FreeNAS in the first place. This kind of thing almost never happens. Here is a better list of odds:
- 90% chance Corral continues and eventually is rock solid stable
- 7% chance the company can never get it running right and just goes under
- 2.9% chance they never get it right and just most to a v11, starting over from scratch again
- 0.1% chance they go back to the old code base (what they did)

 

[Ericloewe]

FWIW, the devs are open to having a migration path from Corral to 9.10.3, and I'll be sure to lobby for that to happen. Docker is the only complication, so let me ask something: Is it better to hang on to Corral until a 9.10.4 that includes Docker support or migrate the Docker VM to 9.10.3, despite the lack of Docker integration with the host?

I think we've all agreed on what's wrong, so let's discuss how to fix things.