Buy v Build

[ryanpr]

My current (6.5 year old) FreeNAS box has a supermicro board with IPMI which I like and rely on at times. However, the board seems to be dead, so it's time for a new build (all other components are old except drives which are 2ish years old).

Current State: I currently use my FreeNAS box to host videos and photos for the family with some music and few movies. It also does PC & Mac backup duty. Finally, it is storage for a ESXi Server.

Desired State: Essentially the same. However, I may dive into Plex, so I don't know about transcoding options and needs if I do something like that. Essentially, I may want room to grow from a processor standpoint. So if a XEON is $50 more than an I3, I'd probably go that route to leave doors open. If it's $200 more, I probably wouldn't.

I've been browsing this forum for information and there's a ton, which is awesome! On this thread (https://forums.freenas.org/index.php?threads/need-your-approval-for-a-freenas-project.68940/) Chris Moore suggested this machine (http://www.tigerdirect.com/applicat...urce=cj&utm_content=8192570&utm_term=12861979) as a prebuilt option. In the past, HP servers required an iLO license, is that still the case, or is remote management included in this board. If so, what RAM is the current recommendation for this machine (want 16 GB)?
$285 (server) + $200 (RAM) = $485 + drives + anything else needed??

If I don't go that route, I'd probably go with the following self built setup:
Fractal R5 ($80-100): https://www.ebay.com/itm/173352521681
Supermicro MBD-X11SSM-F-O ($200): https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813183013
Intel Xeon E3-1220 V6 Kaby Lake ($210): https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16819117790
16 GB ECC RAM (~$200)
Good PSU (~$70) from recommendations on this site (Seasonic I think is what I'm seeing recommended)
$80 + $200 + $210 + $200 + $70 = $860

As much as I like building machines, the HP looks like it's about $380 less. I know the self built has a Xeon, but the I3 I found looks like it's only about $40 less. And if I cut the MOBO and CPU in half, it'd still be $200 more than the HP. And I couldn't find a cheaper MOBO option from the suggested hardware list.

So, actual questions I need help with
1. Does the HP have remote console (like IPMI) so I don't need a keyboard/mouse/monitor hooked up and if so, does it require a separate license?
2. What RAM does is suggested?
3. Will it work well to serve files and iSCSI targets for an ESXi host?

Thank you!!!

 

[MatthewSteinhoff]

1. Does the HP have remote console (like IPMI) so I don't need a keyboard/mouse/monitor hooked up and if so, does it require a separate license?
2. What RAM does is suggested?
3. Will it work well to serve files and iSCSI targets for an ESXi host?

1. I don't think the HPE ProLiant ML10 Gen9 has ILO/IPMI. I scanned the quickspecs and didn't see a note nor does it have the second NIC that may indicate ILO.

Most of the time, HP allows basic remote management without a license. There are web sites that have near universal HP ILO advanced license keys if you don't mind the raping and pillaging of corporate America. I'm typically happy with the included HP ILO and never bother stealing an advanced license.

2. RAM... I use whatever ECC the OEM recommends. For a NAS-only box, if multiple RAM speeds are supported, I generally go with whatever is least expensive, even if it is slower. If I'm running VMs I might spring for the faster RAM if it isn't that much more expensive.

3. Yes, FreeNAS does iSCSI as well as anything else. (I still use NFS for my XenServer hosts though since I find it easier and more flexible.)

4. Not that you asked but that Tigerdirect HPE M10 link shows a Intel Pentium G4400 CPU. It only has a 3,568 Passmark. Plex recommends 2,000 Passmark for each transcoded HD stream. If you're running Plex on your FreeNAS server and have more than one transcoded stream, you may be CPU-bound. (The E3-1220 pushes over 8,000 Passmarks.)

Since you already have an ESXi server, I'd run Plex in a VM there and mount the media share from the FreeNAS server. Best of both worlds assuming you have enough horsepower on the ESXi side.

Cheers,
Matt

 

[Chris Moore]

Will it work well to serve files and iSCSI targets for an ESXi host?

The HP system only has room for FOUR internal drives, and it isn't just because that is how many drive bays, that is all the SATA ports, if I recall correctly. It has been a while since I got into the specs on it. That brings us back to

(all other components are old except drives which are 2ish years old)

I am guessing that you want to use your existing drives? How many do you have, because you need enough room for them...
Physically and connectivity wise.

Finally, it is storage for a ESXi Server.

You said this is the current state, so I will guess that your current state is providing you with enough performance. If you tell use more about the failed hardware, we may be able to make more appropriate recommendations for replacement hardware that will perform better.

 

[gpsguy]

Search the forums for more details on the ML10 Gen 9. Probably around April 2017.

 

[ryanpr]

Thanks for all the replies, let me answer the questions that were asked.

Current State:
SM X9SCM-F Motherboard
(I think) 4 core, 8 thread Intel Xeon E3120 (2,241 PassMark [1])
2x 4TB WD Red mirrored in ZFS, but at ~82%, so looking to upgrade storage, likely 2x 8TB. But could keep the 2x 4TB for backups or some other concern. That said, 2x4TB + 2x8TB + 2xSSD OS drives > 4 SATA Ports on the HP server, so I think this disqualifies the setup. If nothing else it'd give me no room to expand, is that accurate?

Re: MatthewSteinhoff
1. Yeah, missed the lack of a second NIC for ILO, dang.
2. RAM Suggestions: got it
3. FreeNAS & iSCSI: Yep, was more worried about the processor, but based on the passmark scores, the pentium is faster than my super old xeon.
4. Passmark comparison and Plex data: Very helpful, thanks!
5. You mentioned hosting Plex as a VM on FreeNAS, based on what I was reading, it looks like they've pushed the VM part of the new FreeNAS back to beta / testing phase. Is there another method to do this?

Re: Chris Moore
Details above in current state, thank you!

All that said, I'm leaning back towards buy. Any thoughts on the build options I've listed in OP?

[1] https://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=Intel+Xeon+E3120+@+3.16GHz&id=1195

Thank you!

 

[Chris Moore]

I would like for you to consider this:

Then look at this:

You already know the price of the Intel Xeon E3-1220 V6, it was your suggestion, but I would like to suggest the Intel Xeon E3-1230 V2.
It is, despite any other factors, still a respectable CPU and it is currently selling for only 75.00 on eBay.

CPU: Intel Xeon E3-1230 v2 SR0P4 3.3GHz Quad-Core Processor Socket 1155 - US $75.00
https://www.ebay.com/itm/173442786352

Pair that with a system board like this:
System Board: Super Micro X9SCM-F Motherboard w/ Heatsink/Fan & I/O Shield - US $75.00
https://www.ebay.com/itm/273350608871

You have a great start to a system that is as powerful as the one you are looking to spend more than $800 on, except much less expensive.
I dig the R5 case. I recommended the exact same one to someone else earlier today. Get that before it's gone.

You might want to throw two or four of these memory modules in the system, more memory is better, but I think you were trying for low budget, unless I am mistaken...

Memory: 8GB Memory RAM for SuperMicro X9 Series - - US $82.00 * 2 = $164
https://www.ebay.com/itm/163130855012

I am sure you can figure the rest out?

 

[Chris Moore]

SM X9SCM-F Motherboard
(I think) 4 core, 8 thread Intel Xeon E3120 (2,241 PassMark [1])

This can't be correct because the Intel Xeon E3120 is a socket LGA775, so it is either a different board or a different chip.

 

[ryanpr]

This can't be correct because the Intel Xeon E3120 is a socket LGA775, so it is either a different board or a different chip.

Yeah, you're right. I found the receipt for the board, but not the chip. Looking back, perhaps an E3-1230 (v1).

 

[ryanpr]

I am sure you can figure the rest out?

@Chris Moore: Thank you!!! I am going with basically what you laid out. And a Fractal R6 instead of the R5 I'd mentioned.

Last question I hope. I'm looking at one of these two Seasonics, but am definitely open to changing to another option.

Focus 550W Semi-Modular: https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16817151203

Focus 550W Modular: https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817151189&ignorebbr=1

Looking at this thread, 550W should be sufficient, just curious if there's a better PSU I should check out. 450W looks like it'd be a bit low in case I ever added drives 5 & 6.

https://forums.freenas.org/index.php?threads/proper-power-supply-sizing-guidance.38811/
35W * 4 drives (possibility) = 140W
Mobo 25W
CPU TDP 69W
6W * 2 RAM = 12W
30W * 3 fans (to be safe) = 90W
Total = 336 * 1.25 = 420W

Thanks!

 

[Chris Moore]

If you want a Seasonic. I never buy them myself, but they make a good supply. I always buy Gold or Platinum rated supply but the last time I bought a regular ATX supply it was an EVGA 650 and before that it was a Corsair 750. The last four supplies I have bought came with the server chassis that I have bought for my most recent four FreeNAS builds.

 

[ryanpr]

I put the machine together and I'm (sometimes) getting 4 beeps on boot. And nothing going to the VGA output. Is there another way to configure IPMI? What do the 4 beeps mean? It's not in the manual error code listing.

Thanks,
Ryan

 

[MatthewSteinhoff]

4 beeps on boot

Unrecognized processor, I think.

Or maybe RAM in the wrong slots?

Cheers,
Matt

 

[Chris Moore]

I put the machine together and I'm (sometimes) getting 4 beeps on boot. And nothing going to the VGA output. Is there another way to configure IPMI?

Exactly what did you end up getting? We had discussed several options. If you bought the second hand board, it could have a static address coded into the IPMI, and that would need a monitor and mouse on the system so you can go into the BIOS to change it. The factory boards, if I recall correctly, have IPMI set to get an IP address from the DHCP server.

 

[ryanpr]

Unrecognized processor, I think.
Or maybe RAM in the wrong slots?
Cheers,
Matt

It was the processor. Luckily I had the E3-1230 v1 so I swapped that in and flashed the bios. I'm now good to go on the current bios.

However, I have a new issue. Both RAM modules are good as they both work in spot 2A. However, when I place 1 in 2A and 1 in 2B I get 5 beeps and a long beep. From the manual, "5 short beeps + 1 long beep Memory error No memory detected in the system". Is that a bad motherboard? Same happens with 1 in 1A and 1 in 1B.

 

[ryanpr]

Also tried RAM from other machine. So that's not it.

I did get BIOS to post after the flash a couple times, so I know the flash worked. I was able to update IPMI settings and get into the system remotely for a minute.

This was all on 1 stick, 2 sticks have never worked together.

 

[Chris Moore]

Also tried RAM from other machine. So that's not it.

I did get BIOS to post after the flash a couple times, so I know the flash worked. I was able to update IPMI settings and get into the system remotely for a minute.

This was all on 1 stick, 2 sticks have never worked together.

I don't know how the slots are labeled, but if you have the X9SCM-F system board, I know that the two black slots need to be populated first starting closest to the CPU. Only use the blue slots if you are installing module 3 and 4.

 

[ryanpr]

@Chris Moore I was going off this document: https://www.supermicro.com/QuickRefs/motherboard/C202_C204/QRG-1270.pdf

It says to fill the blue slots first.

"When installing memory modules, the DIMM slots should be populated in the following order: DIMM2A, DIMM2B, DIMM1A and DIMM1B."

 

[MatthewSteinhoff]

Sounds like you have a bad stick or are putting them in the wrong slots. Did you end up with the X9SCM-F motherboard? Grab the instruction manual and follow the directions. Pretty much the best advice I have.

Cheers,
Matt

 

[ryanpr]

For kicks I put the pair in 1A/2A and got the same result. So if I put a single DIMM in 1A OR 2A I am fine. Dual in 1a/1b or 2a/2b doesn't work.

Ok, just did another experiment. I put a DIMM in 1A and another in 2A. It boots. However, that's not the suggested arrangement. Is it possible the bridge for the dual channel memory is broken? I've never had this happen before.

 

[Chris Moore]

For kicks I put the pair in 1A/2A and got the same result. So if I put a single DIMM in 1A OR 2A I am fine. Dual in 1a/1b or 2a/2b doesn't work.

Ok, just did another experiment. I put a DIMM in 1A and another in 2A. It boots. However, that's not the suggested arrangement. Is it possible the bridge for the dual channel memory is broken? I've never had this happen before.

What kind of memory?