SFF-8087 SAS to 4x SATA breakout cable - multilane vs not multilane?

[snicke]

Are there different types of SFF-8087 SAS to 4x SATA breakout cables? Here I find:

1. One that is marked "multilane": http://www.webhallen.com/se-sv/dato...tilane_sas-kabel_sff8087_till_4xsata_7-pin_1m
2. Another that is NOT marked "multilane" but have the same visual appearance: http://www.webhallen.com/se-sv/dato...ff-8087_36-pin_till_4xsata_7-pin_1m_rod-svart

What's the difference except for the fact that the "mulitlane" cable above is 3 times the price of the cable not marked as multilane?

Can I use both for full speed to/from a M1015 hba to SATA 6.0Gb/s hard drives?

 

[jgreco]

See the SAS primer sticky. A "lane" is merely a 6Gbps channel. In a breakout cable, you can have up to four lanes and they each go to an individual drive.

https://forums.freenas.org/index.ph...-sas-sy-a-primer-on-basic-sas-and-sata.26145/

 

[snicke]

See the SAS primer sticky. A "lane" is merely a 6Gbps channel. In a breakout cable, you can have up to four lanes and they each go to an individual drive.

https://forums.freenas.org/index.ph...-sas-sy-a-primer-on-basic-sas-and-sata.26145/

Yes I've read that thread before I posted this question. But to me it didn't answer my questions above. That's why I ask the questions.

So again. What is the difference of the cables above? Is there any difference at all? Can I use both for full speed to/from a M1015 hba to SATA 6.0Gb/s hard drives? Please answer the specific question.

 

[jgreco]

Yes I've read that thread before I posted this question. But to me it didn't answer my questions above. That's why I ask the questions.

So again. What is the difference of the cables above? Is there any difference at all? Can I use both for full speed to/from a M1015 hba to SATA 6.0Gb/s hard drives? Please answer the specific question.

[M]ost SAS deployments involve larger numbers of disks, and SAS has some special connectors used to reduce wiring and aggregate lanes together.

For SAS 6Gbps, this is often the SFF8087 (internal) or SFF8088 (external). Four lanes gives you a total capacity of 24Gbps over a single SFF8087 connector.

[...]

A multilane connector may be broken into its four individual lanes using a breakout cable. For example, if you get an SAS HBA, it probably comes with one or two SFF8087's on it, but you may want to directly attach hard drives. A breakout cable allows this. This is a SFF8087-to-single-SAS breakout cable[...].

Also, in some scenarios, a mainboard may offer discrete SAS ports which you desire to aggregate into a multilane cable, and so reverse-breakout cables are available as well.

 

[snicke]

Yes, I did read all that. That's why I'm confused because to me both the break out cable here: http://www.webhallen.com/se-sv/dato...tilane_sas-kabel_sff8087_till_4xsata_7-pin_1m and the cable here http://www.webhallen.com/se-sv/dato...ff-8087_36-pin_till_4xsata_7-pin_1m_rod-svart seem to be exactly the same cable, breaking out one SAS connector to 4 SATA connectors. But why is one of them 3 times more expensive than the other then when both comes from the same manufacturer? That's the confusing part and that's why I ask the question: Is it any functional difference between the cables I've linked to or are they functionally the same (except for maybe quality etc.)? Someone who has worked with these kinds of cables should be able to answer "No there is no difference from a functional point of view (except not knowns like quality etc.)" or "Yes there is a fundamental difference. They look the same from the outside but...".

 

[jgreco]

Since I don't speak the language those webpages are in, I am unqualified to do more than to impart the knowledge I do hold upon you so that you have a better chance of evaluating the words that are there successfully.

What you just read is what I know. As far as I'm concerned, it's the relevant information on the topic. Beyond that, I cannot tell you what the difference between your two proposed cables is. I don't know. I can tell you that as someone who has worked in the industry a long time, there's a lot of bullshit out there. For example, Monster Cable sells 14/2 speaker cable on a 500 foot spool for $390 (BHPV). Genesis sells their Audacity 14/2 for $136/500ft - plus it's rated CMR (instead of merely CL3). Though you have to go through a distributor to get that price. I can't really tell you what it is about the Monster Cable that makes it 3x the price of the (in my mind) better Audacity cable. They're both copper. They do the same thing.

The same COULD be true of the products you referenced. It COULD just be different manufacturers (many of whom just source their cables from AMP anyways). It COULD be some special purpose cable. But I am unwilling to merely look at pictures and try to draw an equivalence. Take the time to do your own homework, including seeing if any of the various numbers describing the items are part numbers that you can use to further drill down and identify what the cables are.

 

[snicke]

Since I don't speak the language those webpages are in, I am unqualified to do more than to impart the knowledge I do hold upon you so that you have a better chance of evaluating the words that are there successfully.

What you just read is what I know. As far as I'm concerned, it's the relevant information on the topic. Beyond that, I cannot tell you what the difference between your two proposed cables is. I don't know. I can tell you that as someone who has worked in the industry a long time, there's a lot of bullshit out there. For example, Monster Cable sells 14/2 speaker cable on a 500 foot spool for $390 (BHPV). Genesis sells their Audacity 14/2 for $136/500ft - plus it's rated CMR (instead of merely CL3). Though you have to go through a distributor to get that price. :) I can't really tell you what it is about the Monster Cable that makes it 3x the price of the (in my mind) better Audacity cable. They're both copper. They do the same thing.

The same COULD be true of the products you referenced. It COULD just be different manufacturers (many of whom just source their cables from AMP anyways). It COULD be some special purpose cable. But I am unwilling to merely look at pictures and try to draw an equivalence. Take the time to do your own homework, including seeing if any of the various numbers describing the items are part numbers that you can use to further drill down and identify what the cables are.

I think we misunderstand each other. I've been quite long in the industry myself, but mainly from a SW point of view, but I've never used a SAS to SATA break out cable before and hardly seen it. Hence, I don't know if there are different standards for a SAS to SATA break out cable and the web didn't tell me (maybe because there isn't). Therefore my question. I do realize that neigther you nor I can tell much about the quality things/marketing bull shit things about the cables I've linked to. That's what not my question either. But if you take ethernet for example, two cables could look exactly the same from the outside but behave very differently being it a CAT5 or CAT6 cable. Hence, two products that look the same are, by defintion (CAT5 vs CAT6), not the same (and also look differently inside regarding shielding etc).

(I've actually done my homework, as I see it, and read the "data sheet"/description-pdf of one of the cables at the manufacturer site before asking the question, but since the same pdf was not to be found for the other cable I couldn't compare. And yes, I also do know about the Voodoo stuff in the HiFi industry with "special" power cables for $10.000 that "will make the sound superior" marketing bullshit...). Here is the pin out of the cheaper cable that I bought in your language: https://www.deltaco.se/sites/cdn/InformationDocumentsLibrary/SAS-127D.pdf.

So my question really is this simple, if a one port SAS to 4 ports SATA is marked SFF8087, are they "on paper" the same? I.e. if you disregard quality, color, Voodoo-marketing things? Or does it exist different standards for a one port SAS to 4 ports SATA that is marked as SFF8087 (like in the ethernet case with different CAT standards) that affects the transfer speed (they look differently inside with shielding/whatever)? I.e are the two cables i linked to the same "on paper" since they are marked one port SAS to 4 ports SATA SFF8087. I.e. am I fine "ON PAPER" with the cheaper one which actually is connected to my M1015 card right now or will I risk to have degrades speed to my drives (compare: CAT5 vs CAT6 ethernet): http://www.webhallen.com/se-sv/dato...6-pin_till_4xsata_7-pin_1m_rod-svart#overview

 

[jgreco]

It very much depends on what the cable was intended for. You won't be able to tell the difference between a normal SFF8087-to-SATA breakout cable and a reverse one without electrical testing or knowing the labels, but they are not interchangeable. I cannot evaluate the appropriateness of a product whose descriptions I cannot read in order to interpret whether or not there's something funny going on.

So, again, all I can really do is explain to you what I think you need to know and then trust that you can go analyze the situation and see if there's some more specific question that you can come back with.

 

[snicke]

It very much depends on what the cable was intended for. You won't be able to tell the difference between a normal SFF8087-to-SATA breakout cable and a reverse one without electrical testing or knowing the labels, but they are not interchangeable. I cannot evaluate the appropriateness of a product whose descriptions I cannot read in order to interpret whether or not there's something funny going on.

So, again, all I can really do is explain to you what I think you need to know and then trust that you can go analyze the situation and see if there's some more specific question that you can come back with.

I use the cable right now and it is working so it is not a reverse cable. The question that remains is if there are different standards for the breakout so I might hit any throughput roof or if all cables like this (not reverse) are the same standard wise? The pdf with the pin out i linked to above is for my particular cable (in my system right now) in English. The information in Swedish is not important for this case. The rest is "international" like SFF8087, the picture and SAS to SATA etc.

Sent from my Galaxy S6 Edge