Verification: LSI -16e to 4xsata backplane

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Rand

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Hi,

just to be sure that I didnt miss anything ...

The LSI -16e cards seem to be much cheaper than the -16i cards so I was thinking to get one of those to combine my 2 current m1015's into one card (to save a pci-e slot).

I believe there are two options to connect the external interfaces to my backplane:
-An ext SAS/SATA to int SAS/SATA (8088->8087) adapter
eg http://www.ebay.com/itm/Double-PCI-...905681?hash=item419d3d2a51:g:CSUAAOSw37tWBygY
(and the appropriate amount of 8088-8088 cables)

-Ext SAS to int 4xSATA HDD cable like this one
http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-Mini-SA...315482?hash=item3f542f251a:g:TrYAAOSwcwhVJIEf

Is there any reason not do do this (except the cable mess) ? Any disadvantages ? Maybe no smart data or whatever?
I am leaning to the direct cable - a little messier but cheaper ...


Thanks
 

Mirfster

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Is there any reason not do do this (except the cable mess) ?
Maybe because it also adds an additional possibility of failure? The cable(s) could fail, the adapter could fail or some other partial failure. Then you are potentially looking at loss of data by going the "cheaper" route. IMHO, spend the extra and keep things simple and internal whenever possible and avoid adding other "points of failure" whenever possible.

Either opt for the 16i or give more consideration as to what you want/need that extra PCIe slot for...
 

BigDave

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IIRC google should turn up some posts in the Serve The Home forum about flashing the 16e
cards with 16i firmware. If this turns out to be possible, then you could use the cards.
 

Rand

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Hm.
Basically I now run 12 disks on 2 M1015s; all mirror vdevs with 1 disk on each M1015, so from a redundancy point I'd loose something, thats a point.

Theoretical goal of a single card was
-slightly reduce power consumption (maybe, haven't checked actual numbers)
-free up a slot for a nvme ssd (was supposed to go to m.2 slot but had to change plans due to board non-availability)

The question is
- is a single -16e and 4 sets of cables less reliable than 2 M1015s and 2 set of cables ? yes
- is a single -16i and 4 sets of cables less reliable than 2 M1015s and 2 set of cables ? yes
- is a single -16i and 4 sets of cables less reliable a single -16e and 4 sets of cables ? I dont know:)
 

Rand

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IIRC google should turn up some posts in the Serve The Home forum about flashing the 16e
cards with 16i firmware. If this turns out to be possible, then you could use the cards.
Ah good idea, will do thx
 

Mirfster

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Curious, but even if you were able to flash an "E" to an "I"; wouldn't you still have the issue where the physical connectors are external thus still need the extra cables and adapter to get everything to connect back internally?

I may have misunderstood or gotten confused (seems easier to do so these days...). ;)
 

BigDave

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Curious, but even if you were able to flash an "E" to an "I"; wouldn't you still have the issue where the physical connectors are external thus still need the extra cables and adapter to get everything to connect back internally?

I may have misunderstood or gotten confused (seems easier to do so these days...). ;)
You're not confused at all buddy, the extra points of failure still exist with external connections.
I only pointed out that there was a possibilty to use the 16e cards, the OP would still have to use
the external type cables and IMHO should heed your warning.
 

Rand

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Well there are 8088-> 4xsata cables (second link in OP), thats the easier/cheaper route (but not as clean as using adapters)

So ideally I'd change 8087 (internal mini sas -> 4x SAS/SATA) cable to 8088 (external mini sas -> 4x SAS/SATA) cable to save 250-300 bucks (getting a cheap 16e as opposed to a 16i)

Whether I really need any of the 16's is another issue;)
 

Mirfster

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So ideally I'd change 8087 (internal mini sas -> 4x SAS/SATA) cable to 8088 (external mini sas -> 4x SAS/SATA) cable to save 250-300 bucks (getting a cheap 16e as opposed to a 16i)
Wow, I just look at a few of them on eBay... Yeah there is quite a price difference between the two. :)
 

BigDave

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As I am too lazy to sweat out the details on this, but it seems the difference in 16e to 16i card prices
are approx. $200.00
If you consider the cost of external cables and the adapter you linked to,
The difference is now down to approx. $100.00
If you spend some time shopping for a used 16i card, I would say you could find a good bargain,
cutting that down to around $75 this would seem to be the way to go IMHO.
Better to wait and do this right, than to purchase problems at a discount ;)
 

Rand

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Well I'd agree but
1. I wouldn't go the adapter route unless there is a strong reason for it ?
2. currently I can get a 16e for €75, cables are €13 each, thats aprox. €130
- I've never seen a 16i even close that. If I am very lucky I might be able to get one for €220 or so ... still a significant difference.

But I appreciate the input:)

Edit: fixed typo
 
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Mirfster

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Just a thought, but what case/backplane are you using (if at all)? Maybe it is possible to replace the backplane with one the that uses just two mini-sas connectors? Just me spitballing...
 

Rand

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SC836 case with integrated backplane Q something.
Its probably replaceable but what avantage would that have (using mini sas connectors) ? Slightly easier cableing but else?
 

BigDave

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Rand

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I actually read that thread a while ago ;)
And I was just too lazy to look for the manual of the backplane I d'led when I obtained it - but I still fail to see what this is about?;)

Edit:
So its 836-TQ - almost right wasnt I - and yes I see it in jgreco's thread and no I still dont see what this has to do with things ?
The only advantage of the A backplane over TQ is "safer cableing" ?
Unless you guys would suggest to get a backplane with expander?
I am mixing SAS/SATA drives so expander wouldnt be my first choice to be honest
 
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BigDave

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The only advantage of the A backplane over TQ is "safer cableing" ?
Ok, buy the 16e card, flash it to 16i firmware and purchase the Mini SAS SFF8088 4i to 4 sata cables
to connect the external ports of the 16e card to the 836TQ backplane. It will be messy, but cheaper!
Curious, but even if you were able to flash an "E" to an "I"; wouldn't you still have the issue where the physical connectors are external thus still need the extra cables and adapter to get everything to connect back internally?
I agree with @Mirfster, I think adding the adapter would be introducing four more possible points of failure.
 

Rand

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I agree with @Mirfster, I think adding the adapter would be introducing four more possible points of failure.
So do I:)

Ok, buy the 16e card, flash it to 16i firmware and purchase the Mini SAS SFF8088 4i to 4 sata cables
to connect the external ports of the 16e card to the 836TQ backplane. It will be messy, but cheaper!

Hm this sounds like "If you insist on this folly then see what you get out of it" ;)
 

BigDave

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Not folly! At this point in time you have made it clear that spending
the money on the recommended 16i is not doable. So buy what you
can afford and make the best of it! Just don't post any pictures of the cables :p
 
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