Powering down external USB drives

[Zyt]

Greetings,
I would like to know if there's a way to spin down an external UBS HDD disk that's been idle for some time?

I know it's possible with SATA drives but the sentence ataidle does not work on those drives.

The external USB drives are Seagate Expansion Portable 2x1TB and 1x2TB.

As I'm in the middle of reorchestrating my hardware at home, I'm left with not so optimal solution for FreeNAS, but the only one I've got for now untill I can afford a hardware that will fit my needs. The platform for the whole NAS system is Samsung N145+ with the system installed on USB. Since the internal drive is only 160GB in size, I'm in need of using external USB HDD.

Since I'll be accessing the data only a few times a day (about two hrs/day) and those disks are not suited for Long term usage, I'd like to ask if there's a command that can manage the USB Drives in FreeNAS?

The reason I'm asking is that when used in windows, I can download a power management software. Maybe there's an option of installing that software as a plugin of some sort?


System specs:

System: 9.2.1.9
CPU: Intel Atom N450
RAM: 2GB non-ECC
2x 1TB + 2TB Seagate Expansion Portable
3x USB2.0

 

[Mirfster]

Not that I know of. Honestly, if I were you, I would not be as worried about power savings as I would be about the USB drive getting accidentally unplugged...

You should really, really, really focus on getting to a system that at least meets minimum requirements instead.

When I look at your setup, all I see is:

 

[Ericloewe]

tl;dr - don't expect it to work via a crummy USB/SATA bridge.

 

[gpsguy]

Ensure that you have verified backups of any critical data.

 

[Zyt]

Hello,
like I said - it is only a temporary setting untill I'll be able to come up with something better.

I'm not worried about detaching the drives. Untill the disk itself has a self-detaching mechanism, there's just no way for them to get plugged off. There are no critical data storaged there as well for this NAS is for testing purposes only.
I just want to know if I really need that kind of stuff before I invest heavy money into it. Besides, the platform meets the minimum requirements for safe and stable operation of FreeNAS. The only thing it's missing is a big drive, but that is not a problem. But before I commit any resources to it I would like to know if FreeNAS is the thing I'm looking for, especially, when for the recommended hardware, I could buy a nice Synology or QNAP NAS that would save me time and effort of configuring everything from scrap.

What worries me in my setup however, is not the security of data, for those are music and films, but the pointless spinning of the disks that will wear the bearings out really quick.


What exactly is tl,dr

 

[gpsguy]

Which is better for my truck? 100,000 freeway miles (or km) or driven like a taxi cab?

Frankly if you are using WD-Reds or their equivalent, don't worry about 24x7 usage. Now the Greens or your USB drives are a different story. With the WD's one needs to run the wdidle to protect them from excessive LCC's.


Sent from my phone

 

[Zyt]

Hmm, I guess that 100,000 miles is definitely better than driving like a taxi cab, but still, 50,000 miles would be even better. The point of my question is:

Is there a way to spin the disks down for night and after, let's say, 3 hours of idle time? If not, then I will simply set time-zones for the NAS to power it down entirely. I don't need it to operate 24/7. I need it for about 5 hrs a day and on weekends when I'm not at home. Other than that, it may be as well powered down. I just prefer not to shut down the whole system just to spin down the disks...

 

[Robert Trevellyan]

Does this

the platform meets the minimum requirements for safe and stable operation of FreeNAS

refer to this

RAM: 2GB non-ECC

or did I miss something?

 

[Zyt]

Yes, ineed it does.

Like I said a few times before, I don't work for CIA and do not need encrypted data or RAIDZ2 for backuping the files. There won't be 1000 users accesing it at the same time either. All I need from NAS for my home use is a print server, data sharing and broadcasting films onto the TV Set. There are only two computers in this net that will be accessing small packages of data (Word, Excell and PDF documents). That's about all. I am NOT going to keep my private and sensitive data on the net. If I wanted to do so, I would have used Google Cloud of Microsoft One Drive for it.

I won't be performing deduplication, encrypting, mirrors and so on. If I loose data on the NAS, I will simply load them anew from external backup storage, just as I am doing it now.

All I want to do is to eliminate the need of dancing around the computers with a pen drive and I'm not going to spend 500 Euros for hardware, when the one I have is sufficient for the task. I can even make this on Windows without playing around with FreeNAS config for all this is possible via Windows functions.

In the future, I indeed plan to create/buy a real NAS and then I will move the server onto another hardware I already have:

M5A78L-M Motherboard 1GbE,
Dual 1Gb PCI Ethernet card
AMD Athlon II X2 270, 2x4GHz,
16 GB ECC RAM DDR3,
4x 1TB Seagate NAS drives RAID 0+1,

but right now I need it for my work (MatLAB computing) therefore, I cannot afford to commit it as a NAS system right now. That's why I'm using the Samsung Netbook. I don't see much point in buying a hardware, when I have it already at home.

In windows, there's a software available, that spins down the drives, when not used. I just wonder if someone know how to do it in freeNAS...

 

[Mirfster]

What exactly is tl,dr

Means "Too Long; Didn't Read"

when the one I have is sufficient for the task

I can even make this on Windows without playing around with FreeNAS config for all this is possible via Windows functions.

I cannot afford to commit it as a NAS system right now. That's why I'm using the Samsung Netbook. I don't see much point in buying a hardware, when I have it already at home.

Seems like you already have all the answers you need then.

Your data, your choice. However; we here are just volunteers and actually do this for our own enjoyment. For me personally, that is to assist in getting people to understand the robustness and "awesomeness" of FreeNas. In what you are trying to use, I highly doubt you would be able to even be able to get the "full experience" without multiple issues or even total loss of data. So as far as I am concerned, I will have to simply agree to disagree and leave it at that. Best of luck in your endeavors and if/when you do decide to use at least the minimum hardware requirements, I will be more than happy to try and assist.

 

[Zyt]

Hello again,
after thorough consideration of the matter I have decided to give it a try. Though I have very limited resources on this matter I will be forced to use second hand (post-lease) mostly hardware.

Here's a configuration I have in mind:

Processor: Intel Core i3 4160T
Cores / threads: 2 / 4
TDP: 35W
Cache: 3 MB Smart Cache
ECC: Yes

Board: Supermicro X10SLL-SF
Slots: 2x DIMM DDR3 1600 MHz
Max RAM: 16GB
LAN: 2x 1Gb Ethernet
ECC: Yes

RAM: GoodRam (W-MEM 1600E38GG)
Clock: 1600 MHz
ECC: Yes
Type: DDR3
Memory: 8GB

Case: Cooler Master Elite 110 mITX (RC-110-KKN2)
Type: Cube
Bays: 3 x 3,5” / 2x 3,5” + 2x 2,5” / 4x2,5”
Fans: 1x120mm + 2x 80mm - the big one is 4-pin I don't know if they are Molex pins or standard though...
Supply: Standard ATX PS2

Supply: Corsair VS Series 450W 80PLUS 120mm FAN


That would be the base, though I'd be really happy if I could find something cheaper for CPU...

Then there's the case of HDDs. Although I am aware of the NAS-Dedicated drives supremacy over any other, I'm afraid I cannot afford them right now, but I plan to run 3x2TB Seagate NAS in check-sums configuation (RAID5?)
So untill I can afford to buy new drives, I would be running those USB drives. I'll be using a USB stick for the system, but I'll maybe add a SSD later on, though I'm not sure it's a good idea...

A full configuration, suiting my needs with enough room to spare would need another 8GB of memory.

So what do you think of it?

 

[Yatti420]

A solid setup is much better then trying USB drives :) You won't need a high end cooler.. I just used my intel one.. I threw all my drives in a beige box.. Ugly with some decent hardware in it.. Ram is utmost importance.. ECC and more the better! Try and get 16gb.. Aslong as your CPU and mobo and ram support ECC you should be fine..

For drives I run a 6x2tb raidz2 (4 drives minimum).. My pool was built awhile ago and upgraded.. If you have expansion in mind you'll want dif case etc.. Look https://jsfiddle.net/Biduleohm/paq5u7z5/1/embedded/result/ for a space calculator.. For your situation you will need to remove the drives from any enclosure and hook them up DIRECT TO MB! NO USB ENCLOSURES!

A single USB drive of 8gb (minimum?) will be fine.. Future proofing 16gb (what i use).. You can always get 2 and mirror which is nice..

Ram try and max out..

 

[Zyt]

I would have stripped them from the cases long time ago, but they are still on warranty, which would be void if I did so...

I use 16GB stick as I had one spare actually :)

The additional coolers are to ensure ventilation, for the case is really small and will be almost entirely full...
http://www.coolermaster.com/case/mini-itx-elite-series/elite110/

 

[mattbbpl]

Hello again,
after thorough consideration of the matter I have decided to give it a try. Though I have very limited resources on this matter I will be forced to use second hand (post-lease) mostly hardware.

Here's a configuration I have in mind:

Processor: Intel Core i3 4160T
Cores / threads: 2 / 4
TDP: 35W
Cache: 3 MB Smart Cache
ECC: Yes

Board: Supermicro X10SLL-SF
Slots: 2x DIMM DDR3 1600 MHz
Max RAM: 16GB
LAN: 2x 1Gb Ethernet
ECC: Yes

RAM: GoodRam (W-MEM 1600E38GG)
Clock: 1600 MHz
ECC: Yes
Type: DDR3
Memory: 8GB

Case: Cooler Master Elite 110 mITX (RC-110-KKN2)
Type: Cube
Bays: 3 x 3,5” / 2x 3,5” + 2x 2,5” / 4x2,5”
Fans: 1x120mm + 2x 80mm - the big one is 4-pin I don't know if they are Molex pins or standard though...
Supply: Standard ATX PS2

Supply: Corsair VS Series 450W 80PLUS 120mm FAN


That would be the base, though I'd be really happy if I could find something cheaper for CPU...

Then there's the case of HDDs. Although I am aware of the NAS-Dedicated drives supremacy over any other, I'm afraid I cannot afford them right now, but I plan to run 3x2TB Seagate NAS in check-sums configuation (RAID5?)
So untill I can afford to buy new drives, I would be running those USB drives. I'll be using a USB stick for the system, but I'll maybe add a SSD later on, though I'm not sure it's a good idea...

A full configuration, suiting my needs with enough room to spare would need another 8GB of memory.

So what do you think of it?

Now you're talking. I don't have the time right now to dig through compatibility, but at first glance this looks like a good platform. Someone may want to chime in on your proposed drive configuration as well (your terminology is wrong for this platform, and I don't have the time right now to look into it).

An SSD for a boot device is really nice for reliability, but by no means necessary. It's an easy thing to skimp on as long as you back up your config file.

Consider a little UPS as well. You won't need a large one, and it could save you some aggravation for a relatively small cost. If you're considering an SSD, I'd pump the money saved from that into this first.

 

[Yatti420]

Yes UPS is a must.. Depending on where you live even vital.. Even if you don't think you'll lose power just get it!! Saves me when power goes out for a minute for whatever reason.. All my gear stays on.. Apologies didn't see mitx build.. if this is the case your definately not going to want USB drives.. USB Drives + FreeNAS = Bad idea!! You can (probably) lose SMART monitoring.. It's only and I would ever only use them temporarily to get data off etc if that was the last option I had.. Hence spinning down a USB drive is just a worse idea.. Build something like I have.. 50 watts-60 watts at most including most my network gear lol.. So if its for power savings not worth it.. That case doesn't hold to many drives.. I don't know what I'd do.. Probably just use a reg case fyi.. People can hate but it gets the job done with some 5.25 to 3.5 converters..

 

[mattbbpl]

In response to: "That would be the base, though I'd be really happy if I could find something cheaper for CPU..."

Since you state your hardware is post-lease (which is fine, BTW), it's hard to tell what would really be cheaper than what you've sourced already. If you're not running a bunch of jails, the Pentium G3220 works great. If you're cash strapped, I'd also recommend heeding this advice:

"(Edit: Marbus90 is insisting that I mention that the TS140 servers, T20 servers, et al, are perfectly good, and may offer a lower priced alternative for some people)."

From this thread: https://forums.freenas.org/index.ph...ll-a-proper-home-freenas-setup-cost-me.28936/

Those servers (with some additional RAM) work great for a lot of people, and some people manage to find some really good deals on them. Just see what you can get one of these for and how it compares. Just make sure you factor in some additional RAM.

 

[Yatti420]

Yes it's all about the ram.. I would think only a very very small subset actually need added arc/zil drives.. If you want to "upgrade" you add ram.. Until you can add no more..

 

[Zyt]

Yes UPS is a must.. Depending on where you live even vital.. Even if you don't think you'll lose power just get it!! Saves me when power goes out for a minute for whatever reason..

As an electrical engineer I can safely assume that in the place where I live we have enough redundancy to keep our houses powered. I live in a heavy industrial area, where power outages mean terrible losses to the factories and mines. As a side effect the whole grid is strengthened to a point of absurd. I've lived for 25 years here and we've never had a power failure. Each station has three transformers, each one capable of handing the load alone. I can safely assume that there will be no power outages in the system. The only way to loose power is during a short circuit, which would destroy the UPS as well unless it has proper protective devices. That's why I wanted to use samsung at the beginning. All his hardware is well integrated and compatible + it has a battery capable of running for over 3 days without power. Couldn't hope for a better UPS! :D

All my gear stays on.. Apologies didn't see mitx build.. if this is the case your definately not going to want USB drives.. USB Drives + FreeNAS = Bad idea!! You can (probably) lose SMART monitoring..

I'll check that and let you know.

It's only and I would ever only use them temporarily to get data off etc if that was the last option I had.. Hence spinning down a USB drive is just a worse idea.. Build something like I have.. 50 watts-60 watts at most including most my network gear lol.. So if its for power savings not worth it..

I just checked that they are 5400 rpm so this is not a problem really, I thought that they were 7200...

That case doesn't hold to many drives.. I don't know what I'd do.. Probably just use a reg case fyi.. People can hate but it gets the job done with some 5.25 to 3.5 converters..

Right now I need the case to take as little space as possible. I plan to use only three drives for now in hardware RAID 5. I'm not a fan of zvols to be honest... Besides, hardware RAID 5 controller speeds the process of check summing so that the whole matrix is speed effective. In the future, when I'll need more disks, I can always use my old case from a normal computer. Besides, it's hard to find a uATX board with ECC and more than 4 SATA slots. Either they are ECC or have more slots. The only one I managed to find so far is GA-X150M-PRO ECC, which uses DDR4 RAM and is awfully overpriced for this task in my oppinion.

 

[mattbbpl]

Right now I need the case to take as little space as possible. I plan to use only three drives for now in hardware RAID 5. I'm not a fan of zvols to be honest... Besides, hardware RAID 5 controller speeds the process of check summing so that the whole matrix is speed effective. In the future, when I'll need more disks, I can always use my old case from a normal computer. Besides, it's hard to find a uATX board with ECC and more than 4 SATA slots. Either they are ECC or have more slots. The only one I managed to find so far is GA-X150M-PRO ECC, which uses DDR4 RAM and is awfully overpriced for this task in my oppinion.

Whoa, are you planning on doing this with FreeNAS or instead of FreeNAS? FreeNAS doesn't play well with hardware RAID controllers.

 

[SweetAndLow]

Whoa, are you planning on doing this with FreeNAS or instead of FreeNAS? FreeNAS doesn't play well with hardware RAID controllers.

This person is probably trolling or just doesn't care to read anything. This thread has made zero progress in the 18 posts that exist so far.

OP should read:

https://forums.freenas.org/index.ph...ning-vdev-zpool-zil-and-l2arc-for-noobs.7775/
https://forums.freenas.org/index.php?threads/hardware-recommendations-read-this-first.23069/