Backup Solutions

[kamin]

What are some reliable backup solutions (non-cloud service) people use to compliment FN?

 

[Adrian]

• Snapshot replication to another (possibly remote) FreeNAS box.
• rsync or snapshot replication to a local external disk. eSATA preferred. A comprehensive script and instructions by Arwen at https://forums.freenas.org/index.php?resources/how-to-backup-to-local-disks.26/ with some discussion and alternative hardware at https://forums.freenas.org/index.php?threads/how-to-backup-to-local-disks.51693/.

I do both. I used to to the rsync backup to a USB3 connected UFS disk, even though UFS has been formally unsupported by FreeNAS for many years.

However, bit rot or design has recently seemingly resulted in UFS disk labels no longer being recognized (no /dev/ufs :() so I have switched to using single disk ZFS pools, which have the advantage of allowing you to scrub the pool to check for (but not fix) errors. Arwen's script has this built in.

 

[Glorious1]

I do snapshot replication to a backup volume in the same FreeNAS box. I don't think it is significantly more risky than backing up to another box in the same house, and I can live with it.

 

[kamin]

I do snapshot replication to a backup volume in the same FreeNAS box. I don't think it is significantly more risky than backing up to another box in the same house, and I can live with it.

If the system ever crashes, how do I reattach the backup volume and any other drives (currently 6 X 2TB in Z2) to a new FreeNAS box? Do I simply save the config and upload again to a new system and attach original hard drives again to the new machine?

 

[Glorious1]

If the system ever crashes, how do I reattach the backup volume and any other drives (currently 6 X 2TB in Z2) to a new FreeNAS box? Do I simply save the config and upload again to a new system and attach original hard drives again to the new machine?

That's a good question, and I hope someone more knowledgeable than I can answer. But I imagine it's the same as with any volume: just put the member disks in the system, and import the volume. You shouldn't even need the same configuration I would think.

 

[kdragon75]

If the system ever crashes, how do I reattach the backup volume and any other drives (currently 6 X 2TB in Z2) to a new FreeNAS box? Do I simply save the config and upload again to a new system and attach original hard drives again to the new machine?

I think this depends on the "crash". If the system is a total loss i.e. flood or fire, you would build a new system, install FreeNAS (same version), build the new pool, ZFS send the backup snapshot(s) over to the new pool and restore the config... At least that would be my approach. I guess I have never tested this and I should. Document the process and print it to store with the backup.

 

[tngri]

Are the RAM requirements for Backup Freenas box the same ?
I mean if the backup box is just a sleeping & wake & backup and nothing else => 1 GB of RAM for Each Physical TB of Storage ? 8GB minimum ?

 

[kdragon75]

Are the RAM requirements for Backup Freenas box the same ?
I mean if the backup box is just a sleeping & wake & backup and nothing else => 1 GB of RAM for Each Physical TB of Storage ? 8GB minimum ?

If it's strictly backup from one source. Start with 8GB and see how it goes. I suspect it will be fine. As this wont be a "hot" server, don't concern yourself with with ARC stats, memory usage, or CPU too much. As long as its as fast as you need for long writes, its fine.

 

[Ericloewe]

Less intensive workloads can naturally get away with less RAM, but the same principles apply.

 

[garm]

FreeNAS isn’t strictly nessesary for your backup box. Personally I’m going to try and get my hands on a few Odroid-HC2 this winter and set up any supported *nix flavor that also comes with ZFS and use as a replication target. No need for any fancy UI or anything other then ZeroTier and ssh.
This will of course be a single drive pool so if data do get degraded it won’t be healed, but with two or three of these storage bricks in as many locations it should be reasonable safe to back up the most important things. It’s also worth considering that it’s going to be very hard to replace a broken drive, so these will be one shot targets. When the drive needs replacing, the backup needs to be initiated once more.

 

[danb35]

Personally I’m going to try and get my hands on a few Odroid-HC2 this winter and set up any supported *nix flavor that also comes with ZFS and use as a replication target.

This sounds like an interesting proposition--I'd like to hear how this goes once you get working on it.

Edit: Heck, ordered a couple to play with. Your link is broken, though--here's a good link: https://www.hardkernel.com/main/products/prdt_info.php?g_code=G151505170472

Much cheaper through their own site than through Amazon.

 

[garm]

If you manage to get a *BSD image running on them, please do tell ^^

 

[danb35]

Well, this thread suggests (if you can get past the blather about how everyone runs everything virtualized any more) that FreeBSD on these things isn't close to a solved problem, though OpenBSD and NetBSD are running (no surprise for NetBSD; it will run on a toaster). But Ubuntu ships with ZFS support, so that should be fine for the set-up you're talking about. I'm not hardcore "de-Penguinize your infrastructure" like @Allan Jude, so Linux is fine as far as I'm concerned. But still, FreeBSD would be cool.

That thread also mentions a (hypothetical, apparently) two-disk HC4 model that would be great, but doesn't exist yet.

Unfortunately, zerotier support on FreeNAS seems to be half-baked, at best. The CLI tools are there, but from there you're on your own. That isn't that bad (the CLI work involved is pretty simple), but it isn't persistent across reboots. It wouldn't seem like the GUI work would be too involved, but that's easy for me to say. There's an issue out for it, but it doesn't look like it's a very high priority.

 

[danb35]

...and here's a US-based seller that's comparable (price-wise) to hardkernel.com:
https://ameridroid.com/products/odroid-hc2

 

[garm]

wont help me though :) need a eu retailer or we have all kinds of fees to pay..

 

[danb35]

need a eu retailer

There are a bunch listed here: https://www.hardkernel.com/main/distributor.php

 

[garm]

Ya I know, but the once I looked through was either out of stock or overpriced. I was going to wait for Amazon to get them back in stock, but they seams to be available again for around €70.

 

[danb35]

Looks like the HC2s will be delivered on Monday. Since they were closed for a holiday through Wednesday, and they're shipping from halfway around the world, that sounds pretty good to me. Got a WD external 8 TB drive on the way to shuck too. Time to play a bit...

 

[danb35]

Got the Odroids today, the drive yesterday. After a bit of messing around (somehow I hadn't made a good flash of the OS image), got both booted, SD cards expanded, drive installed in one of them and off to the races. I'm running badblocks on the drive right now, which is going to take a few days to complete. What I've found so far:

• The thing is pretty quick.
• The USB/SATA bridge isn't recognized by smartctl, so you need to feed it -d sat to tell it the device type.
• At least with the (vented) cover installed, drive cooling is very poor. With under an hour's uptime, the drive temp is at 52 deg C. Granted that it's in a pretty warm room, that's still not good at all. Edit: This was while running badblocks; idle the drive temp is at 42.
  
• Neither smartmontools nor zfsutils-linux is installed on the stock Ubuntu image, but they're easy to add using apt.
• Hardkernel.com are lying when they say there are only three disk mounting screws; there are in fact seven.
• ZFS kernel modules aren't installed by default either, and don't seem to want to install due to the system running a 32-bit kernel:

Code:

Setting up zfs-dkms (0.7.5-1ubuntu16.3) ...
Ok, aborting, since ZFS is not designed for 32-bit kernels.

That's going to be a bit of a problem if I can't work around it...

Edit 2: Rather than continue to drag this thread further off-topic, I'm writing up what I'm doing on my wiki. And being a wiki, you can add/edit as appropriate.

 

[pro lamer]

snapshot replication to a backup volume in the same FreeNAS box. I don't think it is significantly more risky than backing up to another box in the same house, and I can live with it.

Some risks:

• Psu failure damaging both pools
• Fan failure causing overheating in the whole chassis/case
• Minor internal wire fire/sparks (?) Correct me if I am wrong

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