Total NOOB looing for help

[s3rv3rguy]

First I will say that I am familiar with using a nas. I have been using a nas for 7 years now. I currently have a synology 718+ which is my second device. it has 2 14tb WD Red Pro drives in mirror.

This is my potential setup for a truenas build which will mostly be used as a media server and file backup.

https://pcpartpicker.com/list/7XYdC6

What I am looking to do is get the new build up and running so I can transfer over all my data. Then hoping I can added the 2 drives from the synology in to the truenas build to expand the storage.

First, is it possible to expand the pool the way I want to double the storage? what is the best way to set this up, mirror or raidz? I can pull a drive from my synology and start with 3 drives in the nas and add the 4th later. Would that be better?

I appreciate the help and apologize if this has been asked before. Just want to make sure I do this right from the start. I don't have a way to save the data off my synology and use all 4 drive from the start in the new build.

 

[sretalla]

2 14tb WD Red Pro drives in mirror.

This is my potential setup for a truenas build which will mostly be used as a media server and file backup.

This creates some problems for us to advise you according to accepted best practices...

With the requirement for file sharing/storage and media serving, the best (most cost-effective) use of the storage would be some form of RAIDZ... however with only 4 disks, RAIDZ2 is very expensive at 50% capacity loss and we wouldn't recommend anything less (i.e. RAIDZ1) due to the risks with resilvering on drives larger than 2TB (which 14TB is clearly way above).

If you wanted to be able to easily add storage in future, 2 disks at a time, you'll be best sticking to mirrors, so that will make what you're suggesting go very smoothly... build the server, make the pool from the 2 new disks, transfer the data across, then take the old disks and put them in and extend the pool to an additional mirror... double the space like you want and just repeat the last bit to add more later.

You do of course end up with a 50% capacity loss to mirrors just like with a 4-wide RAIDZ2, but it's more flexible to add just 2 disks at a time later if that's a goal.

The protection is slightly more risky as there are a good number of scenarios where you can lose your pool with the loss of 2 disks at the same time...

Here's the illustration of what happens for 2 disks failing with 4 disks total in each different pool configuration... red represents a pool loss, yellow represents pool degraded:

With mirrors, there's a 1 in 3 chance that a second disk failure will be the wrong disk and will kill your pool.

Anyway... simple answer to your question is, yes, you can do what you want easily and end up with a pair of mirrors in a pool.

If you wanted to go a different way with it, you could do something a little more advanced to create a degraded RAIDZ2 pool and copy data to it, then replacing the 2 missing disks with the old ones.

That does imply that any adding of disks needs to also be in RAIDZ2 (so minimum of 4 additional disks... would be Ok for that chassis as it should have 4 empty slots).

 

[winstontj]

Can you rent cloud space for a bit to free up your synology drives? There are ways to encrypt and obfuscate data so it is unrecognizable (for privacy reasons) to make it safer to put it in the cloud.

Other comments would be the usual: Are you sure you want to use non-ecc memory? And... IPMI is invaluable.

 

[s3rv3rguy]

This creates some problems for us to advise you according to accepted best practices...

With the requirement for file sharing/storage and media serving, the best (most cost-effective) use of the storage would be some form of RAIDZ... however with only 4 disks, RAIDZ2 is very expensive at 50% capacity loss and we wouldn't recommend anything less (i.e. RAIDZ1) due to the risks with resilvering on drives larger than 2TB (which 14TB is clearly way above).

If you wanted to be able to easily add storage in future, 2 disks at a time, you'll be best sticking to mirrors, so that will make what you're suggesting go very smoothly... build the server, make the pool from the 2 new disks, transfer the data across, then take the old disks and put them in and extend the pool to an additional mirror... double the space like you want and just repeat the last bit to add more later.

You do of course end up with a 50% capacity loss to mirrors just like with a 4-wide RAIDZ2, but it's more flexible to add just 2 disks at a time later if that's a goal.

The protection is slightly more risky as there are a good number of scenarios where you can lose your pool with the loss of 2 disks at the same time...

Here's the illustration of what happens for 2 disks failing with 4 disks total in each different pool configuration... red represents a pool loss, yellow represents pool degraded:
View attachment 52915

With mirrors, there's a 1 in 3 chance that a second disk failure will be the wrong disk and will kill your pool.

Anyway... simple answer to your question is, yes, you can do what you want easily and end up with a pair of mirrors in a pool.

If you wanted to go a different way with it, you could do something a little more advanced to create a degraded RAIDZ2 pool and copy data to it, then replacing the 2 missing disks with the old ones.

That does imply that any adding of disks needs to also be in RAIDZ2 (so minimum of 4 additional disks... would be Ok for that chassis as it should have 4 empty slots).

I do see what you are saying. Mirroring and raidz1 are both expensive based on the capacity loss. It will be a while before I am comfortable with the software along with having the funds to build it. Would likely be best to go with a 5 drive raidz2 that will only be a 40% loss and effectively triple my storage, in theory. An extra $350 to buy one additional drive is only about 1/8th the cost of the entire build. See attached.

I still have a lot of learning to do. I haven't used Linux for quite some time (11 years) and everything on synology is quite simplified. Almost plug and play.

For a media server (mostly) will a cache drive be necessary? After doing research, it sounds like it wouldn't do much. Would it really help the performance?

I'll have to look in to building a degraded raidz2 and adding the drives later. That is one solution. I will also have to look at a backup. Might have a solution to do that. Copy everything off, build my array and copy it all back to the new device.

 

[s3rv3rguy]

Can you rent cloud space for a bit to free up your synology drives? There are ways to encrypt and obfuscate data so it is unrecognizable (for privacy reasons) to make it safer to put it in the cloud.

Other comments would be the usual: Are you sure you want to use non-ecc memory? And... IPMI is invaluable.

I think I'm ok with non ecc. Most of my data is something i could get back with not much effort. Media and photos for myself, family and work.

I have never had IPMI before. My current nas just sits most of the time and never touched. I interact with the virtual machine and apps running more than i do the actual interface. What advantage would i get from this?

 

[NugentS]

The only comment I would make over and above what others have said is that this is all consumer / gamer grade kit. It s not server kit, and you are building a server

 

[winstontj]

I think I'm ok with non ecc. Most of my data is something i could get back with not much effort. Media and photos for myself, family and work.

I have never had IPMI before. My current nas just sits most of the time and never touched. I interact with the virtual machine and apps running more than i do the actual interface. What advantage would i get from this?

IPMI is remote management. It means you can do things like access and make bios changes without having a keyboard and monitor attached or without being physically present at the machine. It makes life a lot easier for management, upgrades, etc.

 

[s3rv3rguy]

The only comment I would make over and above what others have said is that this is all consumer / gamer grade kit. It s not server kit, and you are building a server

I know it's consumer /game grade. I guess i need to look at other options or give up and just continue with a consumer nas. Or buy a pre built.

I did find an asus board that supports ecc unbufferef ram. Do you have suggestions?

 

[s3rv3rguy]

IPMI is remote management. It means you can do things like access and make bios changes without having a keyboard and monitor attached or without being physically present at the machine. It makes life a lot easier for management, upgrades, etc.

I do understand what it is. I just haven't ever used it and don't know what advantage it would give me when I'm usually in the same room as the server.

 

[s3rv3rguy]

I know it's consumer /game grade. I guess i need to look at other options or give up and just continue with a consumer nas. Or buy a pre built.

I did find an asus board that supports ecc unbufferef ram. Do you have suggestions?

Sorry. I do want to build it right if i build one.

 

[NugentS]

I am not saying it won't work. TN does run on gaming gear but there are issues you need to be aware of.
1. PCIe Lanes and Slots - generally aren't enough (or the useless PCie x*1)
2. SATA Ports = generally aren't enough
3. Network Ports - quite often crap realtek or similar
4. No ECC
5. No IPMI

Do not be tempted to go for those crappy PCIex*1 SATA expansion cards with 4,6,8+ SATA ports on them if you run out of SATA Ports they will cost you data.

Your proposed board has:
6 SATA Ports, using 1 for boot = 5 disks maximum although you could use an M.2 to boot from and give yourself 6 drives
2 PCIe *16 (however usually these will drop to *8 if you use both)
1 PCIe *1 (largely useless)

You will need a GPU as your CPU doesn't have one - there goes a decent PCIe Slot unless you go for something like: Ebay UK Link. BUT I rather suspect that won't transcode (if you were planning on doing so, even if the version of TN lets you do so) [Note if you get one of those cards (or similar) make sure you get the cable as its non-standard.]. I assume it will work with TN

Remember this is an always on device - so take care of heat problems before they destroy things.

For the case, never underestimate the ability to get at the disks to swap them out / add a new one in. Read the comments on the Node804 (the second one in particular) on pcpartpicker - there doesn't seem to be a lot of space in that case to get at disks and somehow you can apparently fit 6 3.5" drives

 

[sretalla]

there doesn't seem to be a lot of space in that case to get at disks and somehow you can apparently fit 6 3.5" drives

You can certainly fit 8 (4+4 rails), but they are not in any way set to be accessed with the system powered on.

 

[NugentS]

Exactly - there is no access