Click bait for Mr. Grinch

[GrumpyBear]

@jgreco Here is a you-tuber wanting to build a FreeNAS on a Ryzen Asus Gaming Motherboard

Link

Somehow I thought of you when I saw this.

The Grumpy one

 

[CompuGlobalHyperMegaNet]

He specifically states in the video that the Ryzen 5 2400G is compatible with ECC memory "if you have the right motherboard", so he knows that's a factor. He also says he hasn't got the ECC memory yet. We can also see in the video that he has already got the mobo for the FreeNAS build, an ASUS RoG Strix X470-I Gaming. The reason he chose the motherboard is that he "wanted something that would support the Ryzen 5 2400G processor and also have some expandability and of course that ever important ECC support".... the mobo in question doesn't list ECC compatibility in it's specs or any ECC DIMMs on it's memory QVL.

Most of us have heard the Matt Ahrens quote regarding ZFS and ECC by now. We know that ECC isn't a requirement but rather a good thing to have and a logical extension of choosing an OS / filesystem geared toward data integrity but for a youtuber with as many subs as Paul to say how important ECC support is and to then use a mobo without ECC support... at best it's an oversight (which is still a big issue in my eyes) but it's such a fundamental and obvious mistake that I really have to question whether his choice of hardware was the result of his best judgement based on research of FreeNAS or whether the system specs were dictated by the marketing goals of his sponsors.

This is another reminder that there's a gap in the market on youtube, for a channel focused on FreeNAS related content and tutorials, run by someone who actually has a decent depth of knowledge on the subject.

 

[GrumpyBear]

I have a lot of respect for Paul. His PC builds are usually realistic and his observations insightful. I should also note that he has an existing FreeNAS build again on an Asus motherboard.

However, it does seem that the inclusion of a FreeNAS may be just because he had to put something in the second motherboard position.

But we have to remember that this channel is a business for him and the content is the channel.

While AMD may support ECC various threads here suggest there are still stability issues with AMD CPUs in FreeNAS and while ECC memory may work in motherboards it is not supported by the motherboard manufacturers and as members here discovered with Intel i3 processors it is difficult to actually determine if ECC is working.

My data is not used for business but it is critical so following the good advice here I used a server grade motherboard and ECC to ensure it’s availability and mirror the data on-site and off for disaster recovery.

While going small is tempting I opted for a micro ATX build in a mid ATX tower as the Micro ATX form factor at the time (3 years ago) had no compromises and the mid tower was to keep the drives cooler.

As the Grinch has stated more eloquently you use the right tool for the job if you want the best results.

 

[HolyK]

Fun fact ... Gaming board (with adequate quality, not the cheap/lowcost parodies) could be at the same price or even more expensive than solid Supermicro MoBo ^^

 

[Ericloewe]

Fun fact ... Gaming board (with adequate quality, not the cheap/lowcost parodies) could be at the same price or even more expensive than solid Supermicro MoBo ^^

Oh yeah. My old WHS 2011 had an Asus board (Z68 something, same as they used on their gaming desktops) that cost pretty much the same as the Supermicro X10SLM+-F in my first FreeNAS server.

 

[CompuGlobalHyperMegaNet]

I have a lot of respect for Paul. His PC builds are usually realistic and his observations insightful. I should also note that he has an existing FreeNAS build again on an Asus motherboard.

I vaguely remembered watching his FreeNAS related videos a few years back, so I've just gone back and watched his build video and the "4 Things My NAS Can Do!" video. I could nitpick about a bunch of stuff but that would muddy what I see as the single biggest issue with his and most other youtuber's videos about FreeNAS. The following quotes demonstrate my point.

"It is definitely recommended to get a USB drive or separate small drive to run the OS off of. Okay, that's about all I know about FreeNAS so far."

He also provides a link to some basic setup videos that he found helpful as "I'm learning as I go".

My point is simple. If a person doesn't have a decent amount of knowledge to backup what they're saying when they make a tutorial video or they don't make it clear from the get go that they don't really know what they're talking about, then they should not be making a tutorial video.

If we use cars as an analogy, gaming hardware is like a sportscar. Performance is what matters. Where as the hardware best suited to a server is more akin to a big rig. Reliability is key. The hardware is different but more importantly, despite several apparent similarities, how you drive them is different. What 99% of youtube videos and listicles about FreeNAS seem to be, is someone who can drive a sportscar really well, hoisting themselves up into the seat of a big rig, turning the engine over and honking the horn (because who wouldn't honk the horn given the chance) and then telling all the other aspiring sports car drivers, i.e. their viewers / readers, how to drive an eighteen wheeler.

However, it does seem that the inclusion of a FreeNAS may be just because he had to put something in the second motherboard position.

But we have to remember that this channel is a business for him and the content is the channel.

I'd be willing to hazard a guess that his motivation for using FreeNAS is two fold. First is that he already has popular, FreeNAS related videos where as most similar channels don't and two, most other channels promoting that monstrosity of a Corsair case are going down the route of a second system dedicated to streaming, which I think makes more sense given the type of user who would buy the Corsair case. So it does make sense that Paul differentiates himself from other channels.

As the Grinch has stated more eloquently you use the right tool for the job if you want the best results.

This is one other issue I find. As @HolyK and @Ericloewe point out, the price difference between a mid range gaming motherboard and a far better suited, higher quality SuperMicro server board is minimal but it's pretty damn rare to hear that from a youtuber or read it in a listicle.

[EDIT] I did just want to make clear that I'm not tarring all youtubers/writers with the same brush. There's some great, informative, accurate videos and articles/blog posts out there (several of which are produced by members of this very forum, such as Josh Parker Ruehlig, DrKK, Ericloewe and The Internet Monkey to name jsut a few off the top of my head) but they're too easily overlooked by the kind of new user who would benefit most from reading or watching them.

 

[CompuGlobalHyperMegaNet]

Oh yeah. My old WHS 2011 had an Asus board (Z68 something, same as they used on their gaming desktops) that cost pretty much the same as the Supermicro X10SLM+-F in my first FreeNAS server.

I remember the X10SLL+F costing about £170 in the UK vs about £130 for a quality Asus ATX board with overclocking abilities. £40 for well suported server grade parts, reliabilty and IPMI is worth every penny and then some.

 

[jgreco]

@jgreco Here is a you-tuber wanting to build a FreeNAS on a Ryzen Asus Gaming Motherboard

Link

Somehow I thought of you when I saw this.

The Grumpy one

Lovely.

 

[adrianwi]

Where is he going to put the drives?

 

[HolyK]

Where is he going to put the drives?

He will use 97-to-1 USB hub ^^

 

[jgreco]

I know a guy who made a ZFS pool out of a massive number of USB thumb drives he got as leftover from some industry show...

 

[Ericloewe]

Sun made a video with that concept. And I'm not sure if it's worse in the original German version or the English dub by the same engineers.

 

[jgreco]

He will use 97-to-1 USB hub ^^

And I should point out that Plugable's stuff is pretty decent, tends to work better. Too bad these are out of stock, right? Because it'd be so fun to go to like three or four of these and then power a few hundred USB HDD's from them. Seems legit.

 

[CompuGlobalHyperMegaNet]

I know a guy who made a ZFS pool out of a massive number of USB thumb drives he got as leftover from some industry show...

Is it weird that that sounds like good fun to me?... a terrible, horrendous idea in oh so many ways but fun non the less.

Sun made a video with that concept. And I'm not sure if it's worse in the original German version or the English dub by the same engineers.

Do you have a link by any chance?... This might just be the video that tops MSI's thermal paste application video (which unsurprisingly, MSI removed from their official channel) - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kSCVahyh3Dk.

 

[Ericloewe]

I looked around a bit and didn't find it in five minutes the other day. It is out there, however.

 

[jgreco]

Is it weird that that sounds like good fun to me?... a terrible, horrendous idea in oh so many ways but fun non the less.

No, I'm totally on board with doing silly stuff just for the hell of it. It's just important to know where the boundaries between "this is safe" and "this is stupid" are.

 

[Elliot Dierksen]

No, I'm totally on board with doing silly stuff just for the hell of it. It's just important to know where the boundaries between "this is safe" and "this is stupid" are.

So the boundary is somewhere around "Hey, Y'all watch this and hold my beer", right?

 

[gpsguy]

I found it in about a minute ... Here are links to the English and German versions of the video.

https://constantin.glez.de/2011/01/...cks-4th-anniversary-video-re-release-edition/

I looked around a bit and didn't find it in five minutes the other day.

I remember watching the video a few years ago.