BUILD Will my hardware be sufficient for all my drives?

[theEmbark]

Hey guys,

I have been looking into adding a NAS to my recording studio for a while and now with a new space it's basically a necessity. I've been building and tinkering with computers my entire life but don't know a whole lot about servers.

A couple years ago I inherited an 8 bay NAS enclosure and 2 SAS systems (hp proliant ml350's). The office they were being used in had a lot of users. So I think the hardware is overkill for what I need.

My use for the system is to store current projects that I can load for various machines in the studio. And to keep a constant backup of the data. I will have at most 3 users accessing the server.

The proliant ml350's are heavy and not rackmounted so I am looking at switching things around a bit. IE buying a rack case and remounting the hardware I actually need.

Current system specs in these machines are:
HP Server Mobo (I can get a specific model number if needed)
2 x Xeon 4510
32gb DDR2 RAM

I want to power:
8 SAS Drives (all paired for Raid 1)
16 HHD (all paired for Raid 1)

Should I just buy a rack case and switch everything as is? Or should I take the time to make some upgrades? What is my bottleneck going to be? The DDR2 RAM? If so I have 48gb of DDR3 (12 stick x 4gb) do they make a 8 DIMM socket 771 board that would be worth upgrading to?

Just looking for some general guidance on putting this together properly from the start. If I need to buy new parts it's not a big deal but if I can recycle some old computers and save some money that's a bonus.

I plan on one of these for storage plus my case of 8 drives http://www.ebay.com/itm/152067840017?ul_noapp=true probably going to put some new fans in it as I've heard complaints of them being loud.

Thanks for your time!
Kevin

 

[ALFA]

Well its a tough call,

First you need a case that can accommodate that amount of disks,

If you want something NO Supermicro, lian li have some tower shape case that can help you perhaps:

http://www.lian-li.com/en/dt_portfolio/pc-d8000/

In any other case you will need one of those supermicro 24 bays cases.

With the supermicro you already have the expander (SATA/SAS), if you get the SAS3 Ver, you only will need 1 cable attached to 1 line of your HBA/RAID (IT mode) card, for the SAS2 Ver, more connectors are required.

With the Lian li route, well its gonna be a little more complex, you need some SAS to SATA Reverse Breakout Cable (for the 16 SATA Disk [I guess they are SATA]) using a 2X ibm m1015 (2 lines x4) and find a Mobo with onboard sas controllers for the another 8 disk (or get another ibm m1015, but this just gonna eat a lot of your PCI slots, and the heat, etc.)

OR you just could get 2x 16 rack server case/ tower case, etc. and connect the second one like a JBOD, well its another option.

beside you will need a good PSU, supermicro give you a nice dual solution, I think you could emulate it with the lian li but not sure there.

here some guidance -> https://forums.freenas.org/index.php?threads/proper-power-supply-sizing-guidance.38811/

and for the RAM, its a nice recommendation around to get the one with ECC (and for that you need a MOBO, a CPU that support it naturally).

 

[danb35]

With the supermicro you already have the expander (SATA/SAS), if you get the SAS3 Ver, you only will need 1 cable attached to 1 line of your HBA/RAID (IT mode) card, for the SAS2 Ver, more connectors are required.

Not so, a SAS2 (or even a SAS1, for that matter) backplane will support the whole thing with a single cable as well (I'm running a SAS2 backplane, though only with 18 drives right now). I understand that SAS1 backplanes have an issue with drives larger than 2 TB, so wouldn't be recommended for that reason.

 

[ALFA]

Not so, a SAS2 (or even a SAS1, for that matter) backplane will support the whole thing with a single cable as well (I'm running a SAS2 backplane, though only with 18 drives right now). I understand that SAS1 backplanes have an issue with drives larger than 2 TB, so wouldn't be recommended for that reason.

You are right, sorry I got confused.

 

[danb35]

You were probably thinking of the expander backplanes vs. the A (which take a single SAS connector/cable for every four drives) or the TQ (which take a single SATA connector for each drive) models.

 

[theEmbark]

Thanks for the feedback guys! I've been searching eBay for a chase and came across this. Would something like this work? I think I'd pull the hardware and upgrade it but other than that. https://www.ebay.com/ulk/itm/152016795815

Thanks,
Kevin

 

[danb35]

That's a nice 24-bay chassis, but the -TQ backplane isn't going to be ideal, and I don't trust the SuperMicro SATA cards it comes with. Take a look at https://forums.freenas.org/index.ph...-sas-sy-a-primer-on-basic-sas-and-sata.26145/ for a lot more info on the backplanes and such. In short, you really want an -E16 model, and a single SAS HBA.

This listing would give you a nearly turnkey server (just add an M1015/9211-8i; you could probably sell the RAID card), but it's quite a bit more than what you posted. This one could work, but I'd want to confirm with them exactly which backplane it comes with. I'm not seeing much right now that sounds really good. It might be worth contacting the seller of this server to see if they have any more, because the closest thing I'm seeing listed is nearly double that price.

 

[ALFA]

Thanks for the feedback guys! I've been searching eBay for a chase and came across this. Would something like this work? I think I'd pull the hardware and upgrade it but other than that. https://www.ebay.com/ulk/itm/152016795815

Thanks,
Kevin

Almost, but in this case you have the expander (BPN-SAS-846TQ) you see that TQ, you dont want it, because you will need then to connect each HDD individualy and for that you need 3 IBM M1015, a bunch of cables, and I think is the Ver SAS1 (aka you cant use HDD over 2 TB) you want something with this expander models>

BPN-SAS3-846EL1 (12Gb/s) / BPN-SAS2-846EL1 (6Gb/s) -> best option

PD. another option is buy the case and change the backplane, I do it in my case (BPN-SAS2-846EL1 to BPN-SAS3-846EL1, just got lucky there), but dunno if the screw holes are in the same position, etc.

 

[danb35]

No, the -TQ is a simple passthrough, so it will work with any size drive--I was using 4 TB drives with the -TQ backplane in my 2U chassis (bought before I knew about SAS expanders). But you're right about "a bunch of cables"--I had a rat's nest of cables in mine, and I had half as many drives.

 

[ALFA]

No, the -TQ is a simple passthrough, so it will work with any size drive--I was using 4 TB drives with the -TQ backplane in my 2U chassis (bought before I knew about SAS expanders). But you're right about "a bunch of cables"--I had a rat's nest of cables in mine, and I had half as many drives.

You are right this is just a simple passthrough, it doesn't have any expander chipset so any HDD could fit it without problem.

 

[Kevin Horton]

Many people complain that rack mount cases with large numbers of HD bays have very loud cooling fans. You have a recording studio. Is noise a concern? If so, that may rule out many rack mount cases.

 

[theEmbark]

Thanks again for the replies,

Yes noise is a bit of an issue. I do have a room that I could stick this in but still keeping noise down is a priority.

I guess I could look into a non rack option. Maybe something I can put in a server cabinet.

What other non rack options might I have that would be quitter? Obviously if I liquid called the machine it would be basically silent but there's a cost to that so before I go that route what options do you suggest?

Thanks,
Kevin

 

[danb35]

Obviously if I liquid called the machine it would be basically silent

Only if you came up with a way to liquid cool the drives as well.

 

[Ericloewe]

Thanks again for the replies,

Yes noise is a bit of an issue. I do have a room that I could stick this in but still keeping noise down is a priority.

I guess I could look into a non rack option. Maybe something I can put in a server cabinet.

What other non rack options might I have that would be quitter? Obviously if I liquid called the machine it would be basically silent but there's a cost to that so before I go that route what options do you suggest?

Thanks,
Kevin

You'd have to look at lower-density solutions, namely more traditional ATX chassis.

 

[theEmbark]

Lian li makes this guy but the price is up there. By the time I've got a PSU etc I'll be up there in cost.

http://www.lian-li.com/en/dt_portfolio/pc-d8000/

I have these cases for my hp proliant ml350 servers that have a lot of space in them. I have a 6 drive sas rack in there and might be able to mod the case to accept two more of those in there so it would hold 18 drives. The trick being to keep it ventilated.

Any links to sites to tweak and no cases like this? Seems like if I got creative and stacked them sideways like the lian li case I could have plenty of ventalation and drives. Would just need a custom bracket.

Thanks,
Kevin



P.s. Anyone have a guesstimate as to electric cost to run a machine like this?