Input on my first NAS build

[CaptionDozla]

Hey Guys, I want to begin by prefacing how new I really am to all this. I have a reasonably good understanding of computers and networking but as I have dived deeper into the NAS/FreeNAS community I have realized how much I still have to learn and plan to take the courses to help learn more. So, with that in mind I was hoping for some feedback on my custom NAS build so far. My main goal with this NAS is personal media storage/data security and I will be the only one using it. It is important I have security with my data, but I do want to recognize others on this site may be a little more serious about it than I am. So, without any further ado here is my build so far.

CPU: Intel Boxed Pentium Processor G4500 FC-LGA14C 3.5 1 LGA 1151 BX80662G4500
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B015VPX190/?tag=pcpapi-20&pldnSite=1

Motherboard: GIGABYTE GA-H270N-WIFI LGA1151 Intel H270 Mini ITX DDR4 Motherboard (largely for the 6 expansion ports)
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01N2V075M/?tag=pcpapi-20&pldnSite=1


RAM: GeIL EVO POTENZA 8GB (2 x 4GB) 288-Pin DDR4 SDRAM DDR4 2400 (PC4 19200) Intel Z170 & Intel X99 Desktop Memory Model GPR48GB2400C15DC
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod...-na-_-na&cm_sp=&AID=10446076&PID=3938566&SID=


Storage: Seagate 2TB BarraCuda SATA 6 Gb/s 7200 RPM 64MB Cache 3.5 Inch Desktop Hard Drive (ST2000DM006) X 2/3
(I am thinking 2-3 of these and I know NAS ready RED drives are preferred but they are just way outside my price point and with this NAS being only for me I felt GREENs where just fine.)
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01IEKG402/?tag=pcpapi-20&pldnSite=1

POSSIBLY this guy for the OS--> Inland Professional 120GB SATA III 6Gb/s 2.5" Internal Solid State Drive (120GB)
(I realize it’s not a super high quality SSD and may spring for a slightly more expensive one but it was the smallest/cheapest I found and figured it was still preferable to a usb 3.0 flash drive because of their overheating issues I know they are prone too)
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B076XMH2JT/?tag=pcpapi-20&pldnSite=1

Also, I have 2 WD 1TB 5400 RPM drives sitting around I will also add in there.


Case: Cooler Master Elite 130 - Mini-ITX Computer Case with Mesh Front Panel and Water Cooling Support
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00DJ6A88G/?tag=pcpapi-20&pldnSite=1


Power Supply: CORSAIR CX-M Series CX550M 550W 80 PLUS BRONZE Haswell Ready ATX12V & EPS12V Semi-Modular Power Supply
(This one primarily because of the $20 rebate and the Semi-modular design to keep cable clutter down inside)
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod...-na-_-na&cm_sp=&AID=10446076&PID=3938566&SID=


So that is what I have so far, I did my best to follow all the forum rules this being my first post and all, but please let me know if I need to fix something and any feedback is really appreciated.

 

[Inxsible]

Motherboard: GIGABYTE GA-H270N-WIFI LGA1151 Intel H270 Mini ITX DDR4 Motherboard (largely for the 6 expansion ports)
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01N2V075M/?tag=pcpapi-20&pldnSite=1

If you haven't bought the components yet, then buy server hardware which is ECC compatible. This would mean your board, cpu and RAM must all support ECC.

Storage: Seagate 2TB BarraCuda SATA 6 Gb/s 7200 RPM 64MB Cache 3.5 Inch Desktop Hard Drive (ST2000DM006) X 2/3
(I am thinking 2-3 of these and I know NAS ready RED drives are preferred but they are just way outside my price point and with this NAS being only for me I felt GREENs where just fine.)

If you are going to use WD Greens, make sure you use wdidle and disable the spin-down feature.

As a general advice: Stay away from building a mini-ITX system for the following reasons

1. Server grade mini-ITX hardware is hard to find
2. If you do find it, it tends to be very expensive
3. It does not allow a whole lot of room for expansion later on.

Since you are in the USA, buying used hardware will give you more for your dollar. Look into Supermicro X8/X9 based systems with DDR3 RAM as that will save you a lot of money over DDR4 RAM which is very expensive currently due to lack of supply.

Of course, if you choose to follow my general advice -- you'd have to look for a new and bigger case as well.

 

[Inxsible]

Storage: Seagate 2TB BarraCuda SATA 6 Gb/s 7200 RPM 64MB Cache 3.5 Inch Desktop Hard Drive (ST2000DM006) X 2/3
(I am thinking 2-3 of these and I know NAS ready RED drives are preferred but they are just way outside my price point and with this NAS being only for me I felt GREENs where just fine.)
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01IEKG402/?tag=pcpapi-20&pldnSite=1

POSSIBLY this guy for the OS--> Inland Professional 120GB SATA III 6Gb/s 2.5" Internal Solid State Drive (120GB)
(I realize it’s not a super high quality SSD and may spring for a slightly more expensive one but it was the smallest/cheapest I found and figured it was still preferable to a usb 3.0 flash drive because of their overheating issues I know they are prone too)
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B076XMH2JT/?tag=pcpapi-20&pldnSite=1

Also, I have 2 WD 1TB 5400 RPM drives sitting around I will also add in there.

Have you thought about your pool structure? You can't just add random drive sizes and expect to get the full space for storage. Please read up on how ZFS, mirrors and RAIDZx works. Here are some links to get you started

Hardware Requirements : http://www.freenas.org/hardware-requirements/

Manual : http://doc.freenas.org/11/freenas.html

Slideshow explaining VDev, zpool, ZIL and L2ARC : https://forums.freenas.org/index.ph...ning-vdev-zpool-zil-and-l2arc-for-noobs.7775/

 

[MDD1963]

Do not waste an SSD for the OS, most run a pair of USB flash drives...(once the OS loads, it's mostly memory resident, so an SSD would be wasted other than fast boot speed, but, is not as if USB flash drives are slow)

Save your SSD(s) for cache drives.....

 

[Inxsible]

Do not waste an SSD for the OS, most run a pair of USB flash drives...(once the OS loads, it's mostly memory resident, so an SSD would be wasted other than fast boot speed, but, is not as if USB flash drives are slow)

If you have the spare SATA port available, then using a SSD is more reliable than USB drives.

Save your SSD(s) for cache drives.....

Not everyone needs a cache drive for FreeNAS. In fact many times it's not recommended unless you know what you are doing.

 

[diskdiddler]

If you have the spare SATA port available, then using a SSD is more reliable than USB drives.

.

I wouldn't listen to this, or rather, I wouldn't consider this unless you have trouble. USB is totally fine and frees you up a potentially wasted SSD.
I've been running USB for 4 years with 1 single failure and the drive actually continued to work after testing in another PC anyhow, with 0 errors.

Saves you a bit of cash, a SATA port, an SSD to use elsewhere (laptop / desktop / console or cache)
My next FreeNAS build, I might use an SSD for the jails drive (it's expendable but would make some functions much faster)

 

[Inxsible]

I wouldn't listen to this, or rather, I wouldn't consider this unless you have trouble. USB is totally fine and frees you up a potentially wasted SSD.

I never said USBs will not work at all. But if you are going to argue that USBs are equally reliable to SSDs then I think you are wrong. The SSDs work on SATA which is usually faster than the regular USB2/3 devices that you will get. Plus the larger size of the SSDs allow for wear levelling which smaller USBs cannot. The only advantage of USBs is that they are cheaper and save you a SATA port if you happen to be short. But if you have extra ports, then SSDs are the way to go. Also, the SSDs are not much more expensive than buying a decent USB stick. A 120GB AData SSD or a Crucial MX SSD can be had for ~$30. 16GB Sandisk Cruzers usually go for about $10-$15. So the saving is not massive.

I've been running USB for 4 years with 1 single failure and the drive actually continued to work after testing in another PC anyhow, with 0 errors.

I have been using the same USB key for 3.5 years without any failures. I used a USB because my Tyan S5533 had 6 SATA ports and my Node 304 case supported 6 drives and I wanted to use all 6 as storage drives. But I am not gonna discount the fact that SSDs are inherently better than USBs for the reasons I have stated above.

 

[diskdiddler]

I never said USBs will not work at all. But if you are going to argue that USBs are equally reliable to SSDs then I think you are wrong. The SSDs work on SATA which is usually faster than the regular USB2/3 devices that you will get. Plus the larger size of the SSDs allow for wear levelling which smaller USBs cannot. The only advantage of USBs is that they are cheaper and save you a SATA port if you happen to be short. But if you have extra ports, then SSDs are the way to go. Also, the SSDs are not much more expensive than buying a decent USB stick. A 120GB AData SSD or a Crucial MX SSD can be had for ~$30. 16GB Sandisk Cruzers usually go for about $10-$15. So the saving is not massive.
I have been using the same USB key for 3.5 years without any failures. I used a USB because my Tyan S5533 had 6 SATA ports and my Node 304 case supported 6 drives and I wanted to use all 6 as storage drives. But I am not gonna discount the fact that SSDs are inherently better than USBs for the reasons I have stated above.

You're implying USB is less reliable, to which I'd answer, it works fine for many of us.
You can buy 3, good brand name USB keys for under $30, 16GB each, maybe even 32GB.

SSD might be ultimately better again, but it feels a waste of SATA port and potential caching drive or speeding up an old spare laptop / desktop / etc.

 

[Inxsible]

You're implying USB is less reliable,

Because they are. See wear leveling. Cheap USBs don't have this.

to which I'd answer, it works fine for many of us.

It might for you. Hey it works for me too. But there are many who have had failures too. Your personal experience is not the holy grail. Neither is mine.

You can buy 3, good brand name USB keys for under $30, 16GB each, maybe even 32GB.

Thereby equalling the cost of a single SSD which will last you longer.

SSD might be ultimately better again, but it feels a waste of SATA port and potential caching drive or speeding up an old spare laptop / desktop / etc.

That's why I always preface my statement with "if you have spare SATA ports..". If they are spare SATA ports, what good is it to keep them empty? Might as well use a SSD for boot. Caching is not required for everyone.

 

[CaptionDozla]

I want to start by thanking everyone for there feedback so far and I wanted to respond to a few of you ^_^

If you haven't bought the components yet, then buy server hardware which is ECC compatible. This would mean your board, cpu and RAM must all support ECC.

I really considered this but my main issue is cost; I would love to do it perfectly which would entail using ECC hardware but when pricing it out it is just to expensive for my smaller budget atm.

If you are going to use WD Greens, make sure you use wdidle and disable the spin-down feature.

Great idea I will definitely do this, thanks!!

As a general advice: Stay away from building a mini-ITX system for the following reasons

1. Server grade mini-ITX hardware is hard to find
2. If you do find it, it tends to be very expensive
3. It does not allow a whole lot of room for expansion later on.

For this one kinda see my response as far as case size at the bottom; but in response to this since the system is solely for me and my personal use only is server-grade material totally required? The one I found is only $86 in one of the places I found it so it would work for my price range. As far as expansion the 6 slots is about the max I see my self going for this build. When I start my business and have learned from this build I will be trying for a business quality machine more along the lines of what you are suggesting.

Since you are in the USA, buying used hardware will give you more for your dollar. Look into Supermicro X8/X9 based systems with DDR3 RAM as that will save you a lot of money over DDR4 RAM which is very
expensive currently due to lack of supply.

I was looking into used stuff because I had a similar thought but I have been burned so many time on used parts I am very wary to buy used stuff again but I will keep looking. I will also look into the Supermicro systems thanks for the tip.

Of course, if you choose to follow my general advice -- you'd have to look for a new and bigger case as well.

Sadly a bigger case will be a problem for me, I live in a pretty small apartment by my self and really barely have room for a mini itx sized case. The one I found fits well into the space I have so sadly I am stuck between a rock and a hard place there.

Have you thought about your pool structure? You can't just add random drive sizes and expect to get the full space for storage. Please read up on how ZFS, mirrors and RAIDZx works. Here are some links to get you started

I would have swore I read some where I could pool the say three 2tb drive and the two 1tb drives seperatly (meaning 2 different pools), but please correct me If I am wrong/misunderstand like I said I am still learning.

If you have the spare SATA port available, then using a SSD is more reliable than USB drives.

Not everyone needs a cache drive for FreeNAS. In fact many times it's not recommended unless you know what you are doing.

Basically my thought process as well ^_^
I think that was all the responses thanks again for the input

 

[Inxsible]

I really considered this but my main issue is cost; I would love to do it perfectly which would entail using ECC hardware but when pricing it out it is just to expensive for my smaller budget atm.

You can really find used hardware in any budget. What is your budget?

I was looking into used stuff because I had a similar thought but I have been burned so many time on used parts I am very wary to buy used stuff again but I will keep looking. I will also look into the Supermicro systems thanks for the tip.

You can always search and post links here. I am sure people on this forum will help out in terms of what to look for when buying older hardware.

Sadly a bigger case will be a problem for me, I live in a pretty small apartment by my self and really barely have room for a mini itx sized case. The one I found fits well into the space I have so sadly I am stuck between a rock and a hard place there.

What case are you looking at? Let us know and hopefully we can find a similar size for m-ATX too.

I would have swore I read some where I could pool the say three 2tb drive and the two 1tb drives seperatly (meaning 2 different pools), but please correct me If I am wrong/misunderstand like I said I am still learning.

You can use different sized disks even within the same pool as long as they are in different vdevs. We can come back to this one after you have selected your hardware.

 

[rvassar]

Because they are. See wear leveling. Cheap USBs don't have this.

There are some, but they're uncommon and hard to find. Most have "Pro" or "Industrial" in their names, they're marketed for pro-photography, video recording equipment, etc... and they usually cost more than a consumer grade 2.5" SSD and it's questionable they have the same degree of oversubscription. One simple way to find out how good a USB flash drive or SD card is... Find out if inserting it into a Raspberry Pi will void the warranty. There are a couple manufacturers that will void the warranty...

Thereby equalling the cost of a single SSD which will last you longer.

I understand there are two camps here. One USB thumb boot is OK, the other avoids. Almost everyone seems to agree that USB is not a good choice for primary storage pool use, with some defecting for migration & backup use cases.

One I haven't seen discussed: I'm wondering if anyone has tried a 2.5" SATA SSD in a USB enclosure as a boot device. $28 for a 60Gb SSD, and maybe another $12 for USB case. Wear levelling & saves a SATA port. I have these sitting here in my junk box tempting me.

 

[CaptionDozla]

Crazy couple of days but thought I would respond again

You can really find used hardware in any budget. What is your budget?

Budgets about $500/550 max but would prefer less

You can always search and post links here. I am sure people on this forum will help out in terms of what to look for when buying older hardware.

I might do that but like I said I have had really bad luck with used.

What case are you looking at? Let us know and hopefully we can find a similar size for m-ATX too.

Sadly my space is limited 15"L x 12"W x 12"H I can make some small adjustments to make a little more room but that's it.

You can use different sized disks even within the same pool as long as they are in different vdevs. We can come back to this one after you have selected your hardware.

Sounds good

Honestly if my original build will work for my purposes I may just stick to it and buy it as things go on sale but of course I am still looking for advice.

 

[chuggs]

Some anecdata to throw in to the discussion: I built my system using mirrored USB drives, as was the recommended configuration 3 years ago. I have had two complete drive failures, in addition to some very perplexing issues where the system fails to boot. These cases are always accompanied by USB error messages in the system log that disappear on next reboot. My next build will probably use an SSD.