Come here to send your rotten tomatoes at my first build ;)

DrZombi

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Good evening Ladies and Gentlemen,

Here is my try at building a FreeNAS configuration. I've read a lot here on the forums and found a lot of very useful information (thanks everybody !!) so I hope I will be able to dodge some of your tomatoes but I'm here for it anyway so please don't hesitate to challenge my build and tell me if you find something wrong. The primary goal is just to build a file server for home but very resilient (I've had some pretty nasty experiences with other solutions). But I may also extend the use of the FreeNAS in the future to serve other different purpose.

Before I go on with the description and links, please keep in mind that: Yes, I know that my configuration will be overkill for my primary objective to just have a big file repository at home but since I work in IT, I will also use this personnal project as a way to learn more about FreeNAS and ZFS. (That's mainly the reason why I'll buy a SLOG which otherwise would not be that much useful for a pure file server).

So I have this in mind:

Motherboard SuperMicro X11SSL-CF (because I want the smallest form factor but would also like to be able to go with as much as 64 GB of RAM if needed since I've read here that you cannot have too much RAM and that a rule of thumb of 1GB of RAM per 1TB of storage is not a bad idea). Also I wanted to go RAIDZ-2, hence 8 disks to minimize the cost of parity and so, the integrated SAS Controller was a must have so that I still have the internal SATAs for SLOG devices, boot disks, etc...
I know that I will need to flash the SAS controller with a passthrough firmware. I remember having read somewhere that I can just ask it to SuperMicro support. Can anyone confirm this or share a link if it's available somewhere ?
Yes I've seen This thread about the problem with BIOS 1.0 and Kaby Lake processors but I really do hope that having been shipped in December 2018, my motherboard will have a 2.0 BIOS at least ! And if not, now I know what to do ;)

RAM will be SAMSUNG 16GB DDR4-2400 UDIMM ECC Unbuffered CL17 Dual Rank, 2 x 16 GB to begin with, or maybe 4 x 16 GB if I can afford it right from the start but I was more like I'll add them later.

My CPU choice is INTEL Xeon E3-1220v6 3,00GHz LGA1151 8MB Cache. Because I don't want to limit myself to only file servicing and may want to install a few VMs or use it as a media server. Did not want to pay the extra bucks for a 1230 and its hyper-threading though...

I was thinking of a Noctua NH-L9I to cool the CPU but this is clearly a part where I'm not used to make clever decisions as I usually buy whole servers at work with the cooling already designed by the vendor. The TDP of the Xeon E3-1220v6 is below what is recommended for this cooling device but I may not be that much limited by the form factor anyway because of the case I've chosen so I'll let you tell me if it's good enough or if there's a potential risk and it would be better to up my game on this one. Also, I've just realized that Intel already ships a cooler with its CPU. Is it cheap or not ? Do you guys think It's better to invest in a Noctua or that I sould stick to the one that goes with the CPU ? I'd like my FreeNAS to be the most cold and silent as reasonably possible and that's why I thought of Noctua in the first place.

The case... I really like the idea of hot-swappable disk bays so I've chosen the SilverStone SST-CS380 which really seems to be a good product. If anyone here have it, please tell me what you think ! I was planning on 2 x SAS breakout cable to plug the SAS controller to the backplane. I'm posting a french reference here but I'm not fixed on the final product since I'll wait to receive my case and begin the assembling before I buy the breakout cables as I want them to be the shortest possible. I will also try to find a cable without sideband as I won't have anywhere to plug it and don't really like free cables plugged nowhere (for electrical interference, and yes, I know I'm a maniac :eek:)

I will use an Intel D3-S4610 SSD 240 GB as SLOG device. If I were a professional, with real SLOG necessity (aka hypervisor using the FreeNAS for example) and an unlimited budget, I would have chosen the Intel P3700 of course. The more consumer-friendly approach is the Intel 750 but still too far of my wallet than I'd like it to be given the limited use of the SLOG that I'll have. I've also made some research around the Startech PCI-E NVMe M.2 adapter but the SSDs in M.2 form factor with Power Loss Protection are too expensive for the extra latency. Again, keep in mind that this is just because of my own personal use. A much more professional user will prefer to go PCI-E NVME for its SLOG but I don't. This is a choice I've consciously made. I found the D3-S4610 is a good compromise between the price and the latency and the 240 GB of its lowest product in the line will give it a good endurance factor over time.

As for my Storage Disks, I've chosen the WD Red NAS HDD 8TB 3,5" SATA 5400RPM. I'd like to achieve the 8x8 TB of raw storage and I really think that the WD Red is the perfect disk for this. Reduction of noise, vibration, temperature, etc... I'm already selling these disks (or their pro counterpart) to my customers when they want a Synology for their backups and those disks never disappointed me ! I thought the non-pro version would be enough for my personal use case.

For the Boot Drive I'll go with 2 x Supermicro SSD SATADOMs 32 GB mirrored (by ZFS, not with a hardware RAID 1). By the way, do you know if I'll have to flash the firmware of the SATA controller for it to be passthrough like the SAS ? Or is it possible with a SuperMicro Motherboard to just ask the SATA Controller to operate in passthrough mode ? (I've read that 16 GB should be enough but I may want to play with the jail and see what apps can be installed there so I thought 32 would be better !)

And at last, but not least, For powering this whole lot of components, I was thinking of a Seasonic FOCUS Plus 650 Gold. Unless you think that going platinum would be worth the extra bucks ? I'm not really sure since I'm not used to size those components but it seems to me that 650W is already pretty Overkill so maybe it's not really useful to go after the betterest efficiency. Still, this is a very little price difference so if anyone can tell me why I would need to spend a little bit more in a Platinum, I would be very interested in the answer :)

Thank you to anyone who have read this until the end and a biggerest thanks in advance for anyone who will be kind enough to contribute :)
 
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Chris Moore

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Yes, I know that my configuration will be overkill for my primary objective to just have a big file repository at home but since I work in IT, I will also use this personnal project as a way to learn more about FreeNAS and ZFS. (That's mainly the reason why I'll buy a SLOG which otherwise would not be that much useful for a pure file server).
Ok. If you are going to bother with a SLOG at all, save your money and get a PCI-E card that is much MUCH faster. Save up for a month or two if needed and get something that is going to be worth having. SATA is too much of a bandwidth limit. This is only a little more expensive and you might even be able to find a better price than this:
https://www.amazon.com/Intel-Optane...=1549317138&sr=8-3&keywords=intel+optane+900p
By the way, do you know if I'll have to flash the firmware of the SATA controller for it to be passthrough like the SAS ?
No. The reason to crossflash the SAS controller is to remove the RAID firmware, but the onboard SATA can be set to AHCI mode and it will be fine.
 

Chris Moore

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Lots of reading in the "Useful Links" button in my signature, but here are some about SLOG. The one on benchmarking might be particularly useful.

Testing the benefits of SLOG using a RAM disk!
https://forums.freenas.org/index.ph...s-of-slog-using-a-ram-disk.56561/#post-396630

Testing the benefits of SLOG
https://forums.freenas.org/index.php?threads/testing-the-benefits-of-slog-using-a-ram-disk.56561

SLOG benchmarking and finding the best SLOG
https://forums.freenas.org/index.ph...-and-finding-the-best-slog.63521/#post-454773
 

DrZombi

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Feb 4, 2019
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Hi Chris,

Many thanks for your answer. It's not pretty long so I think I'm not that much mistaken in my choices :)

Ok. If you are going to bother with a SLOG at all, save your money and get a PCI-E card that is much MUCH faster. Save up for a month or two if needed and get something that is going to be worth having. SATA is too much of a bandwidth limit. This is only a little more expensive and you might even be able to find a better price than this:
https://www.amazon.com/Intel-Optane-SSD-900P-280GB/dp/B077B9NMW2/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1549317138&sr=8-3&keywords=intel+optane+900p
https://www.amazon.com/Intel-Optane...=1549317138&sr=8-3&keywords=intel+optane+900p

This is exactly the problem. 300+ $ is a lot more than I can afford for an "educational" SLOG. As I said, I've read a lot and I have well understood the use cases of SLOG and why it is best to use a PCI-E NVME. I've searched a lot to find an affordable solution but there's not yet. And since I will mostly use my FreeNAS as a file server, it won't even be used unless I turn sync=always if I'm not mistaken. So this will be the last part I buy (if I buy it), and really, only just to play with it and see how this works. And also because I don't want to have to write my ZIL to the pool with the write penalty of RAIDZ-2 etc. I know that a SATA SSD is faaaaaar from the best choice for a SLOG device. Trust me I heard you. I'll see I if can have a better deal when it's time to buy it but I still think that the D3-S4610 will be better than the default in-pool ZIL, and if I am ever to really use the NAS as a VM datastore, of course I know that I'll have to buy a real SLOG and make some more research about the ZFS tuning required to operate VMware storage.

No. The reason to crossflash the SAS controller is to remove the RAID firmware, but the onboard SATA can be set to AHCI mode and it will be fine.

Ah perfect ! This is the information I needed ! Thank you :)
Do you confirm that the only way to obtain the SAS firmware is through the SuperMicro support ?
 

Chris Moore

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Do you confirm that the only way to obtain the SAS firmware is through the SuperMicro support ?
No, the firmware that Supermicro has is older. You can get the firmware from the chip vendor site.
 

Chris Moore

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And also because I don't want to have to write my ZIL to the pool with the write penalty of RAIDZ-2 etc.
You can partition it and manually add it to the poos so that you can use one device for both SLOG and L2ARC.
 

DrZombi

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No, the firmware that Supermicro has is older. You can get the firmware from the chip vendor site.

Humm. Broadcom has bought so many people these days that they can't seem to be able to cope up with updating their firmware pages. I could find the SAS 3008 product page but there is nothing more than a "Product Brief".

The SuperMicro Support gave me a 16.00.01.00 IT firmware and I also found a lot of threads and pages pointing to this tuto: https://www.servethehome.com/flash-lsi-sas-3008-hba-e-g-ibm-m1215-mode/. It tells us to flash the firmware using the one downloadable at broadcom under the SAS 9300-8i product page. It's not exactly the same files but it's still a 16.00.01.00 IT firmware from April 2018. I could not find anything more recent.
 

DrZombi

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You can partition it and manually add it to the poos so that you can use one device for both SLOG and L2ARC.

Wow ! You are the first one I hear who says it's safe to partition a disk to put both the SLOG and L2ARC on the same device ! I read a lot of warnings on this so since this is my first FreeNAS build, I'll stick to some more common options ;). Plus, I did not plan to use an L2ARC at all. It would consume much more RAM than I can put in my motherboard, considering the size of my pool and it will give me no benefit at all unless I keep reading the same files again and again. Seems more like an interesting feature when you're using your ZFS in a production environment, running some VMs.
 

Chris Moore

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Wow ! You are the first one I hear who says it's safe to partition a disk to put both the SLOG and L2ARC on the same device ! I read a lot of warnings on this so since this is my first FreeNAS build, I'll stick to some more common options ;).
I wouldn't do that on a server for work, but if you are just playing with it for home, it is not like you will over work the hardware in a home environment. I have a 400GB, Intel SSD DC P3700, that has been formatted with 4k sectors and over provisioned to 144GB. I also partitioned it to have three partitions, one for swap, one for SLOG and one for L2ARC and I have used it for some testing on my system at home. Works well enough for me to play with, but I wouldn't do that for the servers I manage for work.
I did not plan to use an L2ARC at all. It would consume much more RAM than I can put in my motherboard, considering the size of my pool and it will give me no benefit at all unless I keep reading the same files again and again. Seems more like an interesting feature when you're using your ZFS in a production environment, running some VMs.
Here is an interesting video that talks about the use of L2ARC:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oDbGj4YJXDw&t
 

DrZombi

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No, the firmware that Supermicro has is older. You can get the firmware from the chip vendor site.

Hummm... After some more reading, I've learnt that FreeNAS does not include a lot of retrocompatibility within its SAS driver and that I should give some more attention to the firmware version I'll deploy not to have a mismatch with the driver. If I'm not mistaken, the current versions of FreeNAS are shipped with a driver requiring a P20 firmware, aka 20.00.07.00. But I've only been able to find this firmware for a 9207_8i SAS HBA, not my SAS 3008. Is it safe to flash ? Or should I give a try to the Broadcom support and see if they can provide me with a P20 IT firmware ??
 

Bozon

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Good evening Ladies and Gentlemen,

Here is my try at building a FreeNAS configuration. ...
I know that I will need to flash the SAS controller with a passthrough firmware. I remember having read somewhere that I can just ask it to SuperMicro support. Can anyone confirm this or share a link if it's available somewhere ?
...

I put the latest version of this document in the resources section. I believe it to be correct based on my research, but I haven't actually executed the process. There is another good document in the resources section that goes into more detail about the whole process. Searching the forum for threads about flashing sas controller is also helpful.

https://forums.freenas.org/index.php?resources/flash-supermicro-onboard-sas-controller.103/
 

DrZombi

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I put the latest version of this document in the resources section. I believe it to be correct based on my research, but I haven't actually executed the process. There is another good document in the resources section that goes into more detail about the whole process. Searching the forum for threads about flashing sas controller is also helpful.

https://forums.freenas.org/index.php?resources/flash-supermicro-onboard-sas-controller.103/

Thank you @Bozon ! I've downloaded the process, I'm sure it will be helpful when I have found the good firmware. I may not have read the entire forum yet so it's indeed possible that I missed something ;)
But I've made some research before posting and my problem is still to find a 20.00.07.00 IT firmware for the SAS 3008. I'll continue searching but if anyone know where to find it, it would be really appreciated. (I'm pretty new to this and do not really know the implications of flashing my SAS 3008 with a firmware of another card :eek:)
 

Bozon

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Thank you @Bozon ! I've downloaded the process, I'm sure it will be helpful when I have found the good firmware. I may not have read the entire forum yet so it's indeed possible that I missed something ;)
But I've made some research before posting and my problem is still to find a 20.00.07.00 IT firmware for the SAS 3008. I'll continue searching but if anyone know where to find it, it would be really appreciated. (I'm pretty new to this and do not really know the implications of flashing my SAS 3008 with a firmware of another card :eek:)

https://forums.freenas.org/index.php?threads/lsi-3008-flash-to-p9-it-firmware.42925/
 

DrZombi

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Why for the 3008? I thought you needed notes to flash the built in SAS Controller on the X11SSL-CF

The notes are very welcome (thanks again, really) but I mostly need the firmware itself as I've not been able to find a P20 (is it P20 with the latest release of FreeNAS ?) for the Broadcom/Avago/LSI 3008 SW.

Why for the 3008 ? Because it seems to be indeed the built in SAS controller on the X11SSL-CF as per the product description:
https://www.supermicro.com/products/motherboard/Xeon/C236_C232/X11SSL-CF.cfm

And since I'm totally new to this world of hba controller firmware cross flashing (I'm more used to go to the support.dell.com page of my servers, DL the most recent firmwares compatible with the VMware HCL and upgrade through iDRAC), I'm not really sure of what can be done and what can't. I see a lot of people flashing their controllers with firmwares from other controllers of the same familly but I don't really know what rules they follow and I'm not very willing to brick my 200$ motherboard lol ;)
 
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The notes are very welcome (thanks again, really) but I mostly need the firmware itself as I've not been able to find a P20 (is it P20 with the latest release of FreeNAS ?) for the Broadcom/Avago/LSI 3008 SW.

I recently completed my first build and looked at that same board for the same reason, that it has an integrated SAS controller. In the end I went with the X11SSM-F board and then picked up an LSI 9207-8i ($60-100 on ebay). The X11SSM-F has 2 PCIe 8x and 2 PCIe 4x whereas the X11SSM-CF has 1 8x, 1 4x and 1 1x. The X11SSM-F also has 2 more SATA ports. They take the same memory, cpu, etc and even have the same NIC.

Have you considered the X11SSM-F board? It has the added advantage that if you go with an HBA that requires flashing you don't risk bricking your board and has more PCIe bandwidth at the expense of not having on-board SAS.
 

DrZombi

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I recently completed my first build and looked at that same board for the same reason, that it has an integrated SAS controller. In the end I went with the X11SSM-F board and then picked up an LSI 9207-8i ($60-100 on ebay). The X11SSM-F has 2 PCIe 8x and 2 PCIe 4x whereas the X11SSM-CF has 1 8x, 1 4x and 1 1x. The X11SSM-F also has 2 more SATA ports. They take the same memory, cpu, etc and even have the same NIC.

Have you considered the X11SSM-F board? It has the added advantage that if you go with an HBA that requires flashing you don't risk bricking your board and has more PCIe bandwidth at the expense of not having on-board SAS.

This is a very good idea ! Nice for other people coming to this thread but unfortunately (or not), I already have the motherboard, so I'll have to deal with it ! :oops:
 
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This is a very good idea ! Nice for other people coming to this thread but unfortunately (or not), I already have the motherboard, so I'll have to deal with it ! :oops:

Ha, I'm sure you'll be fine either way. If nothing else there is a nice simplicity of having the SAS on the board. I'm certainly no expert on FreeNAS. Looking forward to hearing how your build goes.
 

Bozon

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The notes are very welcome (thanks again, really) but I mostly need the firmware itself as I've not been able to find a P20 (is it P20 with the latest release of FreeNAS ?) for the Broadcom/Avago/LSI 3008 SW.

Why for the 3008 ? Because it seems to be indeed the built in SAS controller on the X11SSL-CF as per the product description:
https://www.supermicro.com/products/motherboard/Xeon/C236_C232/X11SSL-CF.cfm

And since I'm totally new to this world of hba controller firmware cross flashing (I'm more used to go to the support.dell.com page of my servers, DL the most recent firmwares compatible with the VMware HCL and upgrade through iDRAC), I'm not really sure of what can be done and what can't. I see a lot of people flashing their controllers with firmwares from other controllers of the same familly but I don't really know what rules they follow and I'm not very willing to brick my 200$ motherboard lol ;)

But the second step of the PDF I sent you has this (http://www.napp-it.org/doc/downloads/flash_lsi_sas.pdf ):

...
2. reflash SAS controller from IR raid 1/10 mode to IT mode without raid. - download IT firmware from ftp://ftp.supermicro.com/driver/SAS/LSI/3008/Firmware/IT/ - extract file and copy the files from the EFI folder to an USB stick
...

3008 is in the path so I am assuming it is for the 3008 LSI chip, of course that could be a clever ruse my supermicro to brick boards. :)
Of course, I don't understand their motive; except if it was for pure hysterical mendacity, which seems like short term fun, but long term bad for business. :p

Or maybe I don't understand something, or I am missing something, super probable given that my icon is BOZO.
 
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