Provide ZFS profiles and advanced setup BEFORE install

[amtriorix]

You cannot create the storage pool at install time and you probably never will be able to do it. The entire idea is to install TrueNAS to a boot medium, boot that, then create your storage pool. The division between boot ("firmware") and storage like in any common appliance is most probably set in stone, because it makes sense. You are free to suggest pool creation at install time via iXsystems' JIRA, though.

Have you even made it to the "create pool" function of TrueNAS after installation, yet? What are you missing?

You can perfectly create a zfs file system at install time and install on top of that a bootable freebsd OS that boots from
the zfs pool. You do not need to have separate disks at all. That is the whole point, to boot from ZFS and to use the filesystem
to separate boot/root/data/vdisk (if needed)

if you run freenas in proxmox, there are no issues seen you can use a storage pool, but there is also usage in a way you simply
take a nas case, dump 6 disks inside and a miniITX server board (pref intel nics and AES-NI) and everything, including the os/truenas
is installed on those 6 disks, boots from it and the same disks serve as data/zvol

 

[Patrick M. Hausen]

1) a mirrored bpool (boot and maybe inclusion of sync/scrub/maintain/tune)
2) a mirrored rpool (root file system with inclusing of truenas and settings etc)
3) a customized dpool (pool with the selected zXraid for data
4) optional, creation if ZVOL (to use in combo with iscsi or whatever)

But I already have

• a mirrored boot/root pool
• a RAIDZ2 "mass storage" pool for my media library and "stuff"
• a mirrored "performance" pool for VMs and jails

The point is - only the boot pool can be created at install time. Everything else is done via the UI after the system is up and running.

 

[amtriorix]

So it is a "storage OS" you can boot. Fair enough. For TrueNAS you have to install first (on a dedicated boot disk or two), but then you have a really pleasant UI to manage your storage disks, iSCSI etc. So to be fair, we should not compare the TrueNAS installer with ZFSguru but a running TrueNAS and its UI. If there's lessons that can still learn in terms of usability, I'm all for it.

Have you given the UI a try, yet? The UI definitely does not slam the whole of your 6 disks into a mirror ...

the pleasant install of truenas is not as advances as the TUI of zfsguru
but on the other hand, the smb/nfs/plugins of truenas, the webinterface as well is far superior.

That is why I suggest to combine both worlds.

We do both agree the zfs pool creation can be done using proper profiles, including if needed 3 different pools.
Once the zfs structure is properly created, everything can proceed as usual with the install of truenas

 

[jgreco]

You can perfectly create a zfs file system at install time and install on top of that a bootable freebsd OS that boots from
the zfs pool. You do not need to have separate disks at all. That is the whole point, to boot from ZFS and to use the filesystem
to separate boot/root/data/vdisk (if needed)

if you run freenas in proxmox, there are no issues seen you can use a storage pool, but there is also usage in a way you simply
take a nas case, dump 6 disks inside and a miniITX server board (pref intel nics and AES-NI) and everything, including the os/truenas
is installed on those 6 disks, boots from it and the same disks serve as data/zvol

Yes, you can, but that's not what FreeNAS/TrueNAS does, because they wanted an appliance model that treated your disks and shelves as pure pool. This simplifies things in the event of a crisis where you have a broken pool -- you can still boot the system, or swap in a new boot media.

There is no interest from the dev team to change this paradigm, so

That is why I suggest to combine both worlds.

it isn't going to happen, as far as I know.

 

[amtriorix]

But I already have

• a mirrored boot/root pool
• a RAIDZ2 "mass storage" pool for my media library and "stuff"
• a mirrored "performance" pool for VMs and jails

The point is - only the boot pool can be created at install time. Everything else is done via the UI after the system is up and running.

Well I did end up after the install of truenas, it did assign the full capacity of my 3TB drives to a mirrored zfs structure,
where I did want to have a raidz2 of 4+2 (or a capacity of +-12TB) and not 6 drives that mirrors one 3TB disk

 

[Ericloewe]

Separate bpool and rpool? This isn't Linux, we have clean water a bootloader that speaks modern ZFS. A single boot pool is plenty good.

Well I did end up after the install of truenas, it did assign the full capacity of my 3TB drives to a mirrored zfs structure,
where I did want to have a raidz2 of 4+2 (or a capacity of +-12TB) and not 6 drives that mirrors one 3TB disk

You must install TrueNAS to separate devices. This is non-negotiable.

 

[amtriorix]

Yes, you can, but that's not what FreeNAS/TrueNAS does, because they wanted an appliance model that treated your disks and shelves as pure pool. This simplifies things in the event of a crisis where you have a broken pool -- you can still boot the system, or swap in a new boot media.

There is no interest from the dev team to change this paradigm, so



it isn't going to happen, as far as I know.

There is no disaster if you have 3 pools, seen the update and maintenance of freenas, the config and os is done at
bpool and rpool (boot and root)

In fact the bpool or rpool, can both have rescue stuf to altroot, scrub, sync, resilver etc the dpool

 

[Patrick M. Hausen]

Once the zfs structure is properly created, everything can proceed as usual with the install of truenas

No. First install. Boot. Then create your structure.

 

[Ericloewe]

Mod note:

This thread is going nowhere. By design, TrueNAS expects to be installed to separate devices. This design is unlikely to change anytime soon.

Please follow the installation instructions and/or the advice given in this thread.

 

[Patrick M. Hausen]

Well I did end up after the install of truenas, it did assign the full capacity of my 3TB drives to a mirrored zfs structure,
where I did want to have a raidz2 of 4+2 (or a capacity of +-12TB) and not 6 drives that mirrors one 3TB disk

You don't install on all of your disks or this happens. You install on one or two disks, then do all the fancy ZFS layout you want to your heart's content.

The boot disks are exclusively for booting and as far as I understood any iXsystems representative speaking with some authority, this is also not negotiable. And I personally am all for it. I have two 32G SATA SSDs for my boot pool.

 

[jgreco]

There is no disaster if you have 3 pools, seen the update and maintenance of freenas, the config and os is done at
bpool and rpool (boot and root)

But that's a dumb design. There's no reason for it, and please note, I was designing UNIX appliance boot environments nearly 30 years ago. I was pleasantly surprised when the FreeNAS 8 design came out that was relatively similar to something I had designed in the early 90's. But ZFS is probably even better, as it allows for a larger number of environments, and it validates the data, allows for redundancy, etc.

In fact the bpool or rpool, can both have rescue stuf to altroot, scrub, sync, resilver etc the dpool

Adding rescue stuff is such a trite amount of crap, though, why have two separate pools? It's pointless complication if you don't need to do it that way, and ZFS provides a way for it to work cleanly. It's all in the appliance firmware, in the boot pool.

Anyways as @Ericloewe says, this isn't going anywhere because this is the way the devs want it, and it's a reasonable design choice.

 

[Dan Tudora]

guys, guys
when you a boring and not tired to repair bug's and other thing's in TN make PLEASE a software for that guy
and after that repair including implementation in MAC OS and Windows of ZFS
IF you a boring

 

[Dan Tudora]

hello
implementation of the FreeNAS/TrueNAS Core midlleware/GUI/API/anything/evrything is FREE
IF you do not want DO NOT BUY

 

[Samuel Tai]

Since this thread has devolved into @amtriorix arguing for adoption of ZFSguru features, and multiple members and moderators explaining the existing design of TrueNAS making this extremely unlikely, no further progress seems possible. As a result, I’m locking this thread.