BUILD X11SSL-CF boot time, bios and Kaby Lake G4560

[ioquatix]

Hi,

I bought this MB new and it arrive today. I finish the build, have OS drive ready, but it takes FOREVER to boot, like sitting there for 30 minutes slowly the numbers at the bottom changing every now and then.

After some research, it appears that the BIOS can't boot the CPU I've bought - the Pentium G4560. However, it's advertised as being supported on the Supermicro website.

So, I did some more digging and found out apparently I need a more recent version of the BIOS to boot.

I tried to flash the BIOS but I couldn't because the machine won't boot to any OS or USB drive. I can't seem to enter the BIOS either (keyboard doesn't seem to be detected/working, perhaps USB in general not working).

I gave Supermicro a call and explained the problem. They asked me "Do you have any other compatible CPU?" - of course that's a reasonable question if I was working in a data center, but for a home server it's pretty ridiculous. They said I can't update bios via IPMI without the IPMI upgrade. So I said "Well, I can RMA this board, but it's going to cost a lot more to do that, shipping it all the way back to Asia just so you can fix it, or you could just flash it via IPMI".

They asked for me to expose IPMI via a public internet address, so I did so and am still waiting to hear back. I am from New Zealand.

It really makes me angry they would put such a critical feature behind a paywall. If I knew this from the start I may have considered different hardware. They advertise support for the CPU but don't state that you might receive a motherboard that's not compatible and will require additional money or RMA to update. Honestly, for the amount of money I spent, I expected quite a bit more than this. For example, if you boot with an unsupported CPU, rather than just flying off into the weeds, why not print "Unsupported CPU, press F1 to update bios". You know, something logical!?

Any thoughts or advice would be appreciated.

 

[ioquatix]

I found some more details:

Someone having a similar issue: https://forums.freenas.org/index.ph...on-first-boot-with-supermicro-x11ssm-f.52594/

A FAQ on Supermicro's website: http://www.supermicro.com.tw/support/faqs/faq.cfm?faq=25865

 

[ioquatix]

I should probably mention, that I do get, after about 30 minutes, to "PEI - CPU Initialization" with a code of 35.

 

[CraigD]

I have question

Did you buy the board locally? or did you import it yourself?

I have no doubt a loaner CPU is easy to get, if spend as much money as I do on computer parts

Have Fun

 

[ioquatix]

I bought it from a reputable online shop, essentially locally.

I may be able to get them to ship me a loaner CPU or buy one second hand. But, the point is, why should I need to go to all this effort to fix the issue? It's not my fault they are shipping hardware and advertising something else. They should state clearly "Does not work with Kaby Lake CPU without a BIOS UPDATE which requires a SUPPORTED CPU to be installed FIRST."

 

[ioquatix]

Here is the reply I got from Supermicro:

The BIOS version on our MB is 1.0. so you would need to update BIOS to support Kabylake CPU.

I apologize for the inconvenience.

Now we have two choices:

1. You can purchase a license key the update the BIOS. Here is a link for your reference:
http://www.wiredzone.com/supermicro-software-management-sft-oob-lic-10024441

2. You can submit the RMA request using the link below:
http://www.supermicro.com/RmaForm/

 

[ioquatix]

Okay, so I got a bit frustrated with them. On the page for that MB, it states:

Key Features

1. Single socket H4 (LGA 1151) supports Intel® Xeon® processor E3-1200 v6/v5, Intel® 7th/6th Gen. Core™ i3 series,
   Intel® Celeron® and Intel® Pentium®

I asked them to pay for the license key on the basis that their specs indicate it should work out of the box.

They came back and said, on the same page is:

• BIOS version 2.0 or above is required to support 7th Generation Intel® Core™ i3 Processors and Intel® Xeon® Processor E3-1200 v6 series

and that they won't pay for license key: "by company policy, the OOB license key has to be purchased by customer." Keep in mind, that I'm in New Zealand and the cost of RMAing the board is going to far exceed the cost of this $20USD license key.

I indicated that the note specifically doesn't mention that: 1/ user should buy motherboard, and then RMA; or 2/ user should buy license key to update bios via IPMI; in order to use a v6 CPU - it might even imply that because the key feature is support for v6 CPUs, that it comes with a v2 BIOS and this note is simply an advisory "Don't downgrade if you are using a V6 CPU". Additionally, that note doesn't mention Pentium CPU at all, so one might reasonably assume Pentium CPU will work fine with any version of the BIOS.

A manager is included in the email now.

Let's see what happens next.

 

[ioquatix]

Here is the reply from manager:

Hi Samuel,

Actually, if you have a board with BIOS 1.0, then it’s a really old board which is from our reseller’s old inventory.
We have no control of how long reseller keeps old inventory.
Boards with BIOS 1.0a was made available since march of 3/2016 and BIOS 2.0 since beginning of this year.
Unfortunately, RMA is our company standard policy.
Otherwise, customer would need to purchase OOB license to upgrade BIOS.
Another option is to contact reseller and request board exchange/return/refund.

The note is intended to inform customer that they need to be aware of what they are purchasing or check with technical support first.

Regards,
Milton

A few notes:

- I did actually briefly talk to them on the phone, outlining the hardware I intended to purchase, and they didn't mention any issue.
- I don't actually know what version the BIOS is, they are the ones that said it's 1.0 in an earlier email. I can't get the system to boot so no way of knowing. [Update: Confirmed BIOS v1.0 via IPMI]
- I refuse to buy an OOB license on principle at this point and am thinking of returning the MB, have emailed reseller all the details and asked for their input.

 

[ioquatix]

I've contacted the reseller and they said:

- Let me see how much the BIOS license key is going to cost. WE might come to an arrangement with our supplier to supply this to you free of charge as this seems the easiest way forward from here.

However, if it's true that my NEW hardware is 16+ months old sitting on the shelf - should I be concerned? I paid full price and received something that was less than expected. It's probably an older hardware revision, definitely an older software revision. I've asked them for a replacement from stock manufactured in the past 6 months, with the BIOS V2.0. Is this reasonable?

 

[NZ_JJ]

A few notes:

- I did actually briefly talk to them on the phone, outlining the hardware I intended to purchase, and they didn't mention any issue.
- I don't actually know what version the BIOS is, they are the ones that said it's 1.0 in an earlier email. I can't get the system to boot so no way of knowing.
- I refuse to buy an OOB license on principle at this point and am thinking of returning the MB, have emailed reseller all the details and asked for their input.

Hi @ioquatix New Zealand is on your side because you spoke with the sales staff.
The Consumer Guarantees Act states that all "all goods sold must be fit for intended use" - meaning that the motherboard must work with the CPU as you described when talking to them.
As long as you said the the CPU and motherboard needed to work together, the re-seller is legally obligated to make it work for you, either by rectifying the problem or upgrading the board/CPU with a workable alternative (ie Sky Lake i3-6100 CPU).

 

[ioquatix]

Thanks NZ_JJ. The entire server was on one invoice, and I think there was a pretty reasonable expectation it would all work together.

Further discussions with Supermicro, as you can imagine, went nowhere. They were firm on options 1 and 2 above - an RMA to send the board to Taiwan to have the bios flashed (I'd have to pay shipping), or me paying to buy an the IPMI license so I can flash the BIOS locally.

Just to show that I did my bit and I'm not making this up, here is the return address on the RMA they asked me to ship to:

Return Merchandise To:
SUPER MICRO COMPUTER, INC.
RMA Department
台灣334桃園市八德區興豐路1899號
No.1899, Xingfeng Rd., Bade Dist.,
Taoyuan City 334, Taiwan

Un-f**king believable. Buying a new board, receiving stock that's probably very old (according to them 16+ months), and then being told I need to pay (and wait weeks?) to fix the issue, leaves a very sour taste in my mouth.

On the side, as mentioned, I started discussing this with the reseller. They have been much more accommodating and I feel sorry they had to deal with this since it's not their fault at all. They apologised, offered a $100 credit on my account, and offered to pay for the IPMI license.

I think the key thing here, is that Supemicro and/or their distributor were really responsible for this situation, had a very simple option to remedy the problem, but refused to do it because "company policy", wasted a ton of everyone's time, created a ton of bad-will (I'm pretty frustrated and upset by this) and in the end the reseller was the one on the hook to fix the problem, but it's really not their of their making.

 

[NZ_JJ]

Thanks NZ_JJ. The entire server was on one invoice, and I think there was a pretty reasonable expectation it would all work together.

Further discussions with Supermicro, as you can imagine, went nowhere. They were firm on options 1 and 2 above - an RMA to send the board to Taiwan to have the bios flashed (I'd have to pay shipping), or me paying to buy an the IPMI license so I can flash the BIOS locally.

Just to show that I did my bit and I'm not making this up, here is the return address on the RMA they asked me to ship to:

Return Merchandise To:
SUPER MICRO COMPUTER, INC.
RMA Department
台灣334桃園市八德區興豐路1899號
No.1899, Xingfeng Rd., Bade Dist.,
Taoyuan City 334, Taiwan

Un-f**king believable. Buying a new board, receiving stock that's probably very old (according to them 16+ months), and then being told I need to pay (and wait weeks?) to fix the issue, leaves a very sour taste in my mouth.

On the side, as mentioned, I started discussing this with the reseller. They have been much more accommodating and I feel sorry they had to deal with this since it's not their fault at all. They apologised, offered a $100 credit on my account, and offered to pay for the IPMI license.

I think the key thing here, is that Supemicro and/or their distributor were really responsible for this situation, had a very simple option to remedy the problem, but refused to do it because "company policy", wasted a ton of everyone's time, created a ton of bad-will (I'm pretty frustrated and upset by this) and in the end the reseller was the one on the hook to fix the problem, but it's really not their problem.

It's good to here the locals are doing their part.
Maybe talk to to them about using that $100 to return the CPU and get the i3-6100 - no BIOS flash for the motherboard required.

 

[ioquatix]

Oh, by the way, I did confirm, it's running BIOS 1.0, I could see that in the IPMI web interface on the front page.

Firmware Revision : 00.53
IP address : 192.[redacted]
Firmware Build Time : 10/16/2015
BMC MAC address : [redacted]
BIOS Version : 1.0 System
LAN1 MAC address : [redacted]
BIOS Build Time : 10/21/2015
CPLD Version : 02.b1.01

 

[ioquatix]

So, the reseller agreed to pay for the OOB license. The order was submitted on the 21st. It's funny because on their website they state 24-hour turn around.

On 6/23/2017 11:18 AM, Alberto Bustos wrote:
Hi [reseller],

Thank you for your order 442688. Your OOB License Key is [removed]

Have a nice day.

Then:

On 24 June 2017 3:38 AM
Hi [reseller],

We used the wrong MAC address to issue this key because another customer named [reseller], from [another country], sent us an email complaining about the shipping cost and included the MAC address on his email, so the sales person got confused and thought that he was you and used his MAC address on your order. I'm really sorry, we just figured this out.

Please send me the BMC MAC address from your motherboard so we can issue the correct key. This key won't work for you.

The shipping cost was already refunded to you yesterday. We don't charge shipping for this, but when the address is international the website puts shipping on it, it's a bug that will be fixed soon and I also apologize for this inconvenience.

Thank you and have a great day,

Of course, they already had the BMC MAC address from the initial order. They had already passed COB on Friday, so I assumed that it would take until Monday for them to sort it out. I replied back and pointed this out matter-of-factly and they started arguing with me. But, finally, after 3 days in total, I received OOB license code and could update BIOS. I wish I could say I am happy, but honestly, I'm just completely shocked by this shitty support and terrible sales who can't even adhere to their own published timeframes.

 

[NZ_JJ]

I'd be interested in updates / final build details and overall impressions of the system. Possibly some photos as well.

I was looking at the exact same MB / CPU combo.

And if you don't mind, what supplier did you use? Sometimes here in NZ it's hard to source good H/W at reasonable prices.

 

[Gremlin]

Haha, I've just signed up to chip into this thread (searching for the last 3 years has always given me the answers I needed). Finally doing it right, bought this X11 board and a v6 E3-1220 v6 and looks like I'll have exactly the same problem. Purchased end of May 2018 I've got around to building and the board has come with BIOS v1 - which doesn't work with v6 CPUs until an update to BIOS v2. Same PEI--CPU initialization and error 35. I've logged a ticket with Supermicro, see what they say, but sounds like from your experience they won't budge.
Looks like I'll be hitting up the seller (PB Tech) and reminding them of the CGA.
*sigh*

 

[Gremlin]

Fair play to SM, their first response tonight was: try this key. Added it, was able to update the BIOS, there was a moment of panic as the board went through several power cycles and part posts, but with no further intervention I could boot to USB etc. Now to start testing the hardware.
Either company policy has changed and they now pity the poor sods getting old stock, or owners have worn them down since last year :) My thanks was answered 2min later closing the case. Great response.