TrueNAS configuration as Video editing server

westsidestudios

Dabbler
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Nov 17, 2020
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Hi everyone,

I would like to use TrueNAS as a shared space for
1) Video source files that are used for editing directly from the NAS
2) A Postgres database for the video editing software Davinci Resolve

So what I need, (I think) is a very fast storage with low latency. Probably on RAID10. Question is, will TrueNAS serve the purpose? (a Google research results in very few but mostly positive results, but nothing that useful). Two or three people should be able to edit videos simultaneously. Most of us are on Mac, but Windows could be used too.

This is the configuration I have in mind: TrueNAS Mini XL+ with 64GB RAM and either
  • SFP+ Ports with 10G SFP+DAC cables
  • or normal 10Gb Ethernet output
Do you think SFP+ is worth the extra money / hustle for lower latency? Or am I better off sticking to Ethernet?

Do you think the Postgres Database will be fast enough and the latency low enough? I guess the whole database could be loaded in the RAM.

Thanks a lot for your time!
Valentin
 

Kris Moore

SVP of Engineering
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iXsystems
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Hello! We do have lots of users running CORE / Enterprise with similar video editing workloads, specifically on Davinci Resolve. We've recently started a specific section of our documents with some tips and tricks on Media editing workflows, suggest you start there:

 

westsidestudios

Dabbler
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Nov 17, 2020
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Thanks a lot! That does make me more confident about out plans. I will order the Mini XL+ asap, but I still don't know wether to use SFP+ or regular ethernet. Do you have any insights on the overall performance of SFP+ vs. Ethernet in a 10Gbit/s enviroment (with low end 10Gbit/s network equipment...)? I have no idea about how big the impact of using fiber :/
 

jgreco

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What do you mean "SFP+ vs ethernet"? :smile: Both fiber and copper are ethernet, it's just a matter of the medium.

We have a good 10 Gig Networking Primer on the forums. The short answer is that SFP+ is both a better technology and cheaper if you're willing to buy on eBay. SFP+ goes farther, uses less power, has lower latency, and since it has been around for far more than a decade, there's lots of options on the used market. Copper is extremely finicky because you have to get four perfect pairs in order to avoid problems, and every transition from a plug to jack is another place for it to go wrong.
 

westsidestudios

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Not an expert over here, sorry :grin: (SFP+ can be copper, too, that's why I did not want to just write "copper")

I was reading about extreme latency differences in the network between SFP+ vs Copper, but I have no Idea how much this latency actually matters. Maybe the latency coming from the NAS itself is so much bigger, that a few microseconds in the transmission will not be a significant improvement.

Copper Ethernet is what I know and it is a lot cheaper for me (I already own the network equipment, so I will have to invest 500€ - 1000€ to transform it to SFP+). But if it will improve the working / editing experience, it would be worth it.
 

westsidestudios

Dabbler
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Thank you for the link, that brings some light in the dark! But still wondering if SFP+ is worth it for me purpose
 

westsidestudios

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Reading it again, I will probably buy the SFP+ option. Sorry for the spam, I really miss the "edit post" function :rolleyes:
Thank you a lot for your help!
 

jgreco

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Thank you for the link, that brings some light in the dark! But still wondering if SFP+ is worth it for me purpose

It's complicated. If you like paddling upstream and using cards that few other users here use, and running into cabling issues (including quality and length), or you just don't want to show off that you've made the jump to faster networking, 10GBase-T is your go-to guy.

Otherwise, twinax ("the other copper") or SFP+ with actual optics are the better choices. My suggestion is optics, even if a bit more expensive. I've bought many hundreds of optics on eBay and have had good experiences with getting things for 1/10th of "new" cost.
 

drinking12many

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It's complicated. If you like paddling upstream and using cards that few other users here use, and running into cabling issues (including quality and length), or you just don't want to show off that you've made the jump to faster networking, 10GBase-T is your go-to guy.

Otherwise, twinax ("the other copper") or SFP+ with actual optics are the better choices. My suggestion is optics, even if a bit more expensive. I've bought many hundreds of optics on eBay and have had good experiences with getting things for 1/10th of "new" cost.

Same I have had great luck buying optical SFPs and cards on ebay for dirt cheap.
 

westsidestudios

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Just bought it along with 4 WD Golds (will buy the other 4 later). Do you think for using it as a cutting server, a read or a write cache would be helpful? Probably the cache SSD is not really faster than RAID10 with 8 WD Golds or is it?

Also I am getting really confused by all the switching options... Should I buy a used enterprise switch of eBay or rather a new QNAP or similar cheap SFP+ plus RJ45 switch?
 

jgreco

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If you purchase some recent newfangled device that natively supports 10G, it is *likely* to be 10GBase-T (copper RJ-45). This is the primary scenario where I think there might possibly be a valid argument for going with 10GBase-T. In most other cases, SFP+ will work out to be cheaper.

A used enterprise switch such as the Dell 8024F will allow you a large amount of SFP+ capacity while also supplying some 10GBase-T ports as well. This is one of the most flexible "fixed configuration" 10G options that is normally available at a low cost (sometimes less than $300).

A new switch like the various Mikrotiks will be quieter, but still at a fairly reasonable price per port.

If you just have a fileserver and a bunch of 1G clients, something like the Dell 5524 is not bad.
 

westsidestudios

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Alright, thank you. So you think Mikrotik, despite the ridiculously low price is a good choice and won't cause too much trouble?

And again: 2-3 People will edit videos and the project database and the source files will be on the NAS. Is a read cache or a write cache SSD a good idea?

BTW: I was a little surprised by the $270 shipping, even to Europe, that seemed a little steep. Still bought it. another $250 in customs are waiting for me...
 

jgreco

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Mikrotik sent me an eval unit of their eight port unit at my request.

I promised them only to say what I thought about the thing, bad or good. I was very impressed given the price point, it showed subtle signs that someone who actually used and deployed networking gear had had a hand in the design.

It is not comparable to my nice Force10 and Dell PowerConnect switchgear. But you wouldn't expect it to be competitive with gear that cost near five figures.

It stands up well to (and generally outshines) the SOHO and SMB Netgear stuff that I feel it is most comparable to, and I say that despite one of my businesses being a Netgear Powershift Partner.

I think the worst thing I can say about it is that the metal can is flimsier than a Netgear's. I have a more detailed discussion of the thing somewhere on the forums but I'm not seeing it right now.

For a home user looking to set up a small low power lab and wanting to go all 10G, it is at the top of my list of things I'd be considering. It's definitely a contender for small business uses as well, though I guess I start to get just a little concerned and might want to have a spare handy. That's still an entirely reasonable concession given the price point.
 

westsidestudios

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The day we will receive the NAS is coming closer, and I need to make a decision – currently leaning towards this one: https://mikrotik.com/product/crs309_1g_8s_in#fndtn-testresults. I assume that is the one you tested?

We would like to connect 4 regular Laptops and 2 Workstations with external 10Gbit/s SFP+ to Thunderbolt network cards. Also, a regular 1Gbit/s Ethernet switch with RJ45. I am afraid to buy things that are not compatible to the NAS or the SFP+ Switch. Is there something you can recommend? I am not even sure about the type of cable, there seem to be copper and fiber cables with SFP+, not sure how much worse the copper ones do. Also, the cables come in different ways (optimized for different manufacturers, but Mikrotik is not listed). I feel like there is so much to do wrong here...

Best wishes
Valentin
 

jgreco

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The 10 Gig Networking Primer is linked to above. I've been driving cross-country all day long and am too tired to do a long bespoke response, sorry.
 

westsidestudios

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I will just do Mikrotik all the way and hope it will fit.

BUT... The NAS just arrived... a month of waiting, 500$ in shipping and customs. And they sent the wrong model. No SFP+, just RJ45.... So disappointing! Not sure what to do as there is time pressure.
 

dev_willis

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Hello! We do have lots of users running CORE / Enterprise with similar video editing workloads, specifically on Davinci Resolve. We've recently started a specific section of our documents with some tips and tricks on Media editing workflows, suggest you start there:


FYI, that link is dead but I think I found the document in question here: https://www.truenas.com/docs/core/solutions/optimizations/mediaentertainment/

It seems kinda light on details tho. And is that information current? E.g., I recall reading around here that jumbo frames aren't "worth it" anymore but maybe they still are in the specific case of video editing? I'm a bit out of my depth here and not totally sure what a frame even is lol

How about the relative performance of RAID types? I understand the various levels of fault tolerance but how significant is the performance difference between, say, RAIDZ1 and RAIDZ2 or the "typical recommendation" of 2+1 RAIDZ? If Z1 is appreciably more performant than the others then I might be willing to accept the risk inherent in single-disk fault tolerance and compensate with more frequent backups. I'm not clear on what exactly 2+1 is.

Are there downsides to disabling Atime?

Does file size or use case make a difference in the speed of LZ4 compression vs no compression?

How can I determine what record size to use? We'll have many multi-gigabyte video files and many more multi-megabyte photo files but there are also a large number of small config-type files as well. Would it be best to find the median file size and set it to that?

Are there things outside of the pool options that I can tweak to improve performance?

Am I asking too many questions? lol
 
Last edited:

wdp

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Apr 16, 2021
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Hello! We do have lots of users running CORE / Enterprise with similar video editing workloads, specifically on Davinci Resolve. We've recently started a specific section of our documents with some tips and tricks on Media editing workflows, suggest you start there:

I know this is dragging up a really old thread, but I am curious what ever happened to this documentation? That would be such an awesome resource.
 

ChrisRJ

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Oct 23, 2020
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It is still available at the location posted by @dev_willis (see above).

Personally, I find this document disappointing. It is "lightweight" and more effort seems to have gone into the non-technical summary than the details. The details are somewhat wrong in that ZFS does not allow for a write cache per se, but a dedicated intent log (ZIL) on a separate and optimized device (SLOG). But I assume that the intended audience would be confused by that level of detail.

To make a general recommendation for a 2*RAIDZ1 pool for media is odd, given that the IOPS delivered from such a pool with HDDs will not be great. It may be ok as an archive location from an IOPS perspective, although in that case I would recommend RAIDZ2/3 for data safety.

Also, the jump between abstraction levels is huge. It starts by more or less an executive summary, and from there jumps directly into technical details. It would be better to provide guidance on how capacity planning is done on a conceptual level first. Then have 2-3 examples where a usage scenario is laid out in detail and translated into hardware.

I know this is a significant amount of work, but it would helpful from a sales perspective IMHO. At the end of the day most customers don't want to buy IT stuff per se but have their business problem solved; and for their buying decision they need reassurance that the vendor is capable and willing to do that.

Overall, I think this page is not helpful to anybody in its current form and wish iXsystem would overhaul or remove it.
 
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